Stability and usability

Right, whereas if it takes one viewport, it can’t be moved to a second monitor, while it takes exactly the same space as the VFB (minus the CC, history, and so on.).
Down-voted with two hands.

While bump is certainly a fake, I would argue that its “correctness” can be quite easily measured by how close it is to a real displaced result. Of course it will only work to some degree, let’s say 1mm displacement viewed from 1m away, but still, you can measure how correct it looks by comparing it to real displaced result and see if normals appear to be facing same way. On the picture above, it looks as if V-Ray’s bump was somehow inverted :slight_smile:

Below, i’ll let you pick which of the two is a 1cm displacement, and which a 1cm color2Bump (hint: one has displaced edges.).
This, through the very basic, by-the-book, setup: add a map to a displace mod, instance the same map into a color2bump, put that into the 100% influence bump slot of the shader.

I am afraid the IPR issues are chicken vs egg kind of problem.

IPR is buggy and unstable because not many people report bugs for it. Not many people report bugs for it because not many use it, and not many use it because it’s buggy and unstable.
You seem to have access to statistics we do not possess, or read wrong.
Either way, wouldn’t you think it wiser to have the interested party tell you how things are, instead of becoming the claimer of truths in their stead?
I thought so.

In general, for any interactive rendering solution to be attractive to users, it needs to meet 4 basic requirements:

1, It needs to be stable
2, Everything needs to update reliably
3, It needs to have fast feedback - any action that takes more than one second from being performed to being reflected in IR VFB is not acceptable
4, It needs to have convenient workflow - It should not be inconvenience to use IPR

Unfortunately, Vray’s IPR does not meet any of these requirements
Big, big statement, for absolutely zero peer-reviewable backup data. I wonder how many hours of work you’ve put into it…

therefore I use it only rarely, and more often than not, I come to a conclusion that choosing to use it was actually a mistake.
I see. You were being your usual positive self.
The issue is always, invariably, with V-Ray, never with how you set up your scene.
It’s a good default heuristic, keep using it, it will serve you well over the years.

I understand there’s some competitive race in this field, but it would have been better if it was released once it’s ready.
What you understand it to be, and what it actually is, are in fact two quite different things indeed.
But do hold on tight to your convictions.

I had hoped the type of conversation this has recently become was not going to be, but here we are and to me this sums up exactly what leaves a bitter taste in my mouth when I come to these forums as of late.

Ok so color2bump gives me the same result, and displaced version looks more like corona’s result than vray’s…


bumptest.zip (9.12 MB)

too true James

Well, I’ll further reduce my input into these type of conversations when they are derailed from exact (as the starting post.) to blanket statement, pub-style, hear-and-say gibberish.
At the very least it won’t contribute to further bad taste at the back of the mouth, if it won’t contribute anything to bettering V-Ray.
Thankfully, the “ignore” function in the forum works, so i won’t even have to bite my lip.

I really hope that the Chaosgroup devs do not think this way, because the competition has never been stronger for V-Ray. I hate to say this, but sometimes the grass seems to be greener on the other side of the fence.

No.
I meant we do not plan our work in reaction to what people think as being the competition, and much less so we’d do a sloppy job at release because of what others think we ought to feel as pressure.
Our collective drive for improvement has well different roots than petty tit-for-tat, market size or money, and its timing is dictated by data, not hear-and-say.
You of all people ought to know this first-hand, counting how many years of releases and service packs you’ve lived, and worked, through.
Being ever so slightly more positive (or even just factual, even if miffed.) is clearly something a license, or years of unwavering support, doesn’t beget.

n.b.: this is a very, very personal reply: nothing to do with the company. I keep bumping into threads with great titles, spoiled time and again by childish trolling. It makes my work to get to actionable data, daily, a true test of patience. One i sometimes fail, especially as writing styles and authors tend to coincide, ten years on. Alas, it is what it is.

For now leave it out of this thread as if it gets derailed any further, I’ll just re-start it.

Don’t worry about it. I’m sure we can achieve more if we approach fixing our grievances on their terms.

Can you send your scene or/and dump files at my mail ?

sent .

Hi James, you have started this thread realativly fast, without verifiing a couple of things, what might be there already, and you don?t know it (EXR Safe from FB e.g.) or eaven think of that some things might simply more different. Each software requiers a different angle of view, having a different workflow in sight. So moaning about Software a) and comparing with b) is the same old story as discussing about Apples and Peas. I know from my own experience, that a little googeling in a time that take me writing all this stuff down, answers my question in a lot of cases more precisly and keep my Eyes even open vor different point?s of view. So I am not complaining! :slight_smile: I only tell you about experiences I made and sometimes i still do with the thing of “using a different software” while having my old workflow in my mind and keeping moaing and questioning myself: Why why why? … then I get a coffe and stop turning the bulb with a Officechair, and using my wrist again - and it shows me, that it also comes again with some maybe some advantages (!). And btw: Corona has it?s own trouble as well…=) best regards & cheers - Kay

PS: you found out what caused the problems with the “Unhandled exeption accours… etc. etc…” ? Interested in, what causes this problem. (and if this did in corona right well without trouble)

PPS: I find really very few things disturbing with vray. It works quiet reliable. Only - yes - the IPR is still in it?s Child?s foot. And it is such an important feature to have! Maybe Vray 4.00.02 should do the job adult like and rockstabel… =)

It was a problem when using proxies + forest color + RT which will be fixed for 3.60.02.

Excellent!