my IR map renders terrible sometimes...and sometimes NOT!!!!

[rhatted]

hello all..
i'm tryin' to do an animation at the moment...
and only got 2 days to knock it out...

this first image...is basically how i'd like the first frame to render...
i have been rendering my IR maps at 356x240 and saving every 10 frames. for a rendering that is 200 frames long....
each IR frame takes about 3mins to render and then when i render from
map it takes about 50s.
i know many things can be tweeked...but i just need this to render out in about 2-3 hours to meet my deadline...

so when i test things...i render out the sequence 1-20 (which respectfully saves IR maps 1 and 11)
a quick avi rendering of frames 9-12 produces the below results...
which however bad they may seem....i am fine with...

http://www.squidmark.com/cafe1.htm


the problem is when i save the IR map for the the full 220 frames (every 10th frame) and render the sequence i get this darker blochtchy rendering which to add insult to injury has the nerve to render out twice as long as the first tests...

http://www.squidmark.com/cafe2.htm

what am i doing wrong!!!!!!

the scen has 2 vray lights with 25 subdiv's eache and the purple boxes have a vraywrapper on it and some global illumination..(the sub-material has self illumination)

thanks for reading thru this.......
plllllllleeeeeeease help...



http://www.squidmark.com/settings.htm


if the images don't display they are
at

www.squidmark.com/cafe1.htm
www.squidmark.com/cafe2.htm
www.squidmark.com/settings.htm

[doriziofilho]

hey man...
for start do you have increase hsp to 50 (for start)
and max and min rate in -3 -1... i am used -5 -1...
but to start is good

[rhatted]

thanks for the tip....
this is just a low res thing i'd like to just knock out quickly.......

the thing is when i just render stills...i'm able to get rather quick renderings...like this below...

my problem arises when i set out render a sequence of frames...
thats when it all falls apart!



http://www.squidmark.com/cafe3.htm

[Erik de Graaf]

Did you read this ?

http://www.chaoticdimension.com/foru...pic.php?t=5014

Check the size (in Mb) f your irradiance map is small its not any good.
Do you get errors during imap rendering ?

Hope you get it done in time i've been there too it's a pain when things don't work when you don't have the time to fix them.

Erik

[J_Bug]

Probably needs very high settings due to all the self illumination. Can't realistically do animation with imap set to -3, -3. Are you using Single frame?

--Jon

[rhatted]

thanks for the input...
i still have 48 hours to make this work...

hopefully i don't have to resort to rendering each file one by one...

J-Bug -

i switched my min max to -3/-1
which was fine.... it still rendered the 25 every 10th frame IR maps in 4 hours...400x300 i don't mind waiting 4 hours if i know..
i'll be able to render out 150 780x420 size frames...at about 50 secs each.
but once again .... when i went to render out my sequence...
it took about 1min 40 per frame...and they still looked horrible

Erik de Graaf -

i have no IDEA how big a file my IR maps should be.
for 25 frames the map is usually like 87kb...
is that to puny of a file size...

how do i get vray to save a larger IR map...so my 700x400 renderings
look decent...
i'll read thru the link you sent me on lunch break
thanks!!!!!!!!!! for the words of encouragement!!!


also just a general question
but what does AA stand for... when talking about min/max numbers

it is the GI irradiance mapping numbers

not the adaptive sub div's numbers right????

i'm just getting confused now!!!!!!!!!


again....
thanks for all the help!!!!!!

[J_Bug]

AA is Antialiasing and the Min. rate/ Max. rate sampling are within that rollout.

I think a good way to look at this scene might be that you have many geometry based area lights because of all of the self illumination on your wall materials.

If you think of each object as a VRay light and consider the fact that you can't set these objects light emissions to 25 subdiv's as you have set your VRay lights you come to a problem of low quality light emission. This has to be compensated for with the GI calculations by increasing the Imap settings and creating more samples for the entire scene. As well, to get a larger (more accurate/ finer resolution) Imap file you need more samples. This is caused by higher settings.

Kinda like juggling on a tight rope

--Jon

Oh... and since the Imap is camera dependant I believe the output resolution settings will affect the saved Imaps quality and size as well.

Just a new thought... Could you use one big (or a few selectively placed) purple VRay light(s) on that wall while calculating the Imap then turn off GI with a VRayWrapper for those materials when you render?

[rhatted]

thats actually what i've wound up doin'....

i actually threw out the GI of the Vray wrapper materials....and just substituded with a
colored vray light...
it works...

i think the main trouble i'm having is that i need to just break up my IR
calculations...

like render 5 IR frames....
then render the corresponding 50 frames in the sequence at the size i want....
my machine is a 1.4 athalon with 1gig of ram...
and it seems to not be able to hack to many frames at a time...

so if i under stand you correct....
they way i have things set up...

my AA is -1/2

and thats no good huh...????

see i've been playing with the min/max numbers right above HSph subdivs
in the Indirect illumination (GI) rollout....

???????
i guess thats why IR maps are taking so long




how fast should my IR maps be calculating with like 4 vray lights
at -3/-1
at 300x200?????

10- 15 mins is a bit long huh????

[J_Bug]

Yes, I think that -1,2 for the AA is good for this scene. You seem to be confusing yourself but that's cool, I've been there and I understand

The Min/Max rate is used anywhere that you need to give VRay a range of sample passes to work within.

I can't really say how long 4 VRay lights @ -3/1 @ 300x200 should take because there are many other factors. 10-15 min doesn’t sound too long for a 1.4 athalon because you have so many small reflective objects (chair legs), set to whatever Max depth, and then there are the self illuminated objects under the catwalk looking structure.

What is your camera move like? (this is important to find the for Every Nth frame)

Do you have any moving objects?

Are you using VRay Materials?

Are you using glossy reflections?

Now that I think about it, The big purple VRay light is the wrong way to go. Now that you've increased your Imap sample passes the self illum material would be better.

A few other issues...

The Refractive caustics are definitely increasing your render time.

Try setting the Reflection/ refraction Max depth to 2 or 3 in the Global switches. Your reflections are so small tha this will probably be good enough.

If you have the VRay lights set to Store with irradiance map then this will cause the Imap to take longer but your renders will take less time.

--Jon

[natty]

hi
i take it your using ADD TO INCREMENTAL ?

[rhatted]

you know what i never even thought about the whole add to incremental...that makes sense...

i don't believe i have that checked!!!....

my camera moves pretty slow....so i may even be able to get away with
render ever 15th or 20th....
hmmm.....

i'm out of the office...but as soon as i get back in the next hour...
i will check about the add to incremental...
and then turn off the purple vray light....
and keep the self illum....gi

i don't have any glossy materials...
and anything really reflective...
i just wanted to show ah quick "mood" kinda lighting...

so everything is pretty much flat....(the chairs may have a tad of glossy)


thanks you guys so much...

i'll post some images inna bit...
cheers!!

[J_Bug]

Good point natty, didn't even think of that. If you're not using Add to incremental then you'll end up with a saved Imap of the last frame and this is then applied to all the frames. It does kinda look like that's the case. This is a required step in rendering out every Nth frame.

--Jon

[natty]

[egz]

some more info here:

http://vray.info/entry.asp?entryID=23

[rhatted]

natty....thanks for the quick and precise comment.....
you hit it on da mark!!!!

i'm back on schedule....whatta great feelin'...

j-bug- appriciate all the helpfull info this afternoon...

thanks for the link egz...
i actually read thru all of that...and have that video saved on my desktop...hehehe
just started panic....and wasn't thinkin' things thru....

good lookin' out ya'll...
-a

i'll post some stills later next week...