New workstation w10 or 11?

[super gnu]

Well as per this thread:

https://forums.chaos.com/forum/chaos...-urgent-advice

I have been forced to build a emergency new machine.

All the parts have arrived (7950x, 128gb Corsair vengeance ram, MSI tomahawk b650 motherboard some 3060 rtx GPU (it would have been fiddly to reuse my old gpu's they are watercooled and my new pc isn't)

It's not an earth shakingly powerful machine but should allow me to work at a reasonable speed.

The last thing I need is a copy of windows. I've only ever used windows 10.. it works, and apparently my 64 core machine wasn't good enough for windows 11 anyway.

However w10 is going to lose support soon. So w11 seems the obvious choice.


Is it stable and usable? Any advantages over 10?

Or should I stick with 10?

[Muhammed_Hamed]

I would say windows 11, the difference is not major, give yourself some time to be used to that. Windows 11 is mostly stable and usable on my side
As you mentioned, whether or not if it is the best option for you, it doesn't matter because Windows 10 loses support soon. And we all have to use Windows 11

Congrats on the new machine, it is pretty powerful and should get things done. One major difference is that this CPU has much better single threaded performance than your old machine, you will observe how snappy the new machine is. It is day and night difference!
I hope you ordered your DDR5 to be AMD compatible, because they will not be stable unless they are tuned for AMD. Another note, like any AMD platform these days if you occupy all memory slots on the motherboard the machine might not be stable, you will need to go up on the voltage of the memory or go down on the frequency. Let us know how this goes

Best,
Muhammed

[super gnu]

Hm. Regarding the ram. I was unable to find a "certified" AMD compatible 128gb ram set. I didn't have time to research too deeply this time.

It seems 4 sticks of ram is barely supported at all. Which may or may not be a major issue. I chose a set that was hynix m-die chips, supposedly the best type for am5. I'll have a fiddle and see if i can get it working stably, as i NEED 128gb ram.



If i could find 64 GB sticks, 2 of those would seem ideal, but i don't think they are on the market yet.

Cross your fingers I'm going to build it this evening.

Worst case I'll run the ram at very slow clocks while i search for a better set, then return these.

[Muhammed_Hamed]

Good luck!

How did it go?

[super gnu]

hm, well the machine is up and running.. vraybenches at 39800 so far.. 5.2 ghz all core. ive been using exotic watercooling setups for years, but this time i decided to keep it simple and have a noctua cromax black cooler. seems to work pretty well to be honest.

my ram seems stable, but refuses to clock over 3600, which is pretty terrible. i could probably spend a few days tweaking settings and get that speed up, but i really cant be bothered to deal with instability.

i wonder.. i -could- send the ram back and get a 96gb set (2x4 which would allow me to clock the ram much higher. however this would sometimes be a bit limiting for the largest scenes... not always, but sometimes.

could you give your opinion on how much difference in performance id get with ram clocked at say, 5800 or 6000 compared to 3600?

i know that vray isnt massively sensitive to ram clocks, but it must make a fair difference.

[Joelaff]

I never found RAM speed to have much affect on VRay anyway. Congrats on the new system.

I am curious if you ever run into file Windows Explorer file copy slowdowns with Win 11 and the 7950x. The only machines that have win 11 here are a an Intel based Dell laptop and a 7995WX. The 7996WX has run into this weird bug where sometimes copying files in Explorer is very slow-- like 200MB/sec or so, rather than 4GB/sec or so for a Gen5 NVME. This doesn't seem to affect other programs loading or saving files, just Windows Explorers copying. I think it is caused by the insane core count of the 7995WX, but curious if anyone has encountered it on other processors. A web search reveals some complaints. So perhaps it does. You see the issue when you try to locally duplicate a about 4GB file-- either one nvme to another, or on the same nvme.

I wish we have Max for linux and we could do away with MS forever.

[Muhammed_Hamed]

vraybenches at 39800 so far.. 5.2 ghz all core.

Looks pretty good, you are not missing on any performance. I have around 40k score with my RAM at 5200 Mhz

ve been using exotic watercooling setups for years, but this time i decided to keep it simple and have a noctua cromax black cooler. seems to work pretty well to be honest.

Same cooler here, it is by far the best at the moment. Better performance than most AIOs
With a custom loop, the CPU will be running a bit cooler and overall a quieter system, although there is no room for overclocking like older CPUs. It will be the same performance
FYI AMD rated the CPU to run at 95 degrees out of box, this is the standard operating temperature for this platform. It might sound odd at the start, but trust me it is a lot better than what Intel has

my ram seems stable, but refuses to clock over 3600, which is pretty terrible

Some people here on the forums are running at 4600 out of box(without playing with anything), if the kit itself is AMD Ryzen 5 certified, with 4x 32 GB sticks.
I'm running at 5200 Mhz, which is the rated speed of my RAM. I got there without much effort
RAM stability is a nightmare and yet to be the biggest issue with this platform, my advice is to stick to an AMD certified kit, 128 GB around 5000 Mhz
Even if it is stable with some stress tests like Aida, it could be unstable with interactive rendering in V-Ray or some random tasks. Use Memtest86 for a few hours to verify memory stability

could you give your opinion on how much difference in performance id get with ram clocked at say, 5800 or 6000 compared to 3600?

No difference

Best,
Muhammed

[super gnu]

thanks for the reply. could you please let me know what AMD certified 128gb ram kit you use that runs at 5200? the compatible list for my motherboard doesnt list any 32 gb sticks that can be used in all 4 slots, and ive not found any 4x32gb kits which claim to be certified for amd 7 series, although ive not looked "everywhere"

[Muhammed_Hamed]

The ones I have are Kingston, I don't see them online anymore. I bought them 2 years ago
Here is a good kit that is AMD Ryzen 7000 certified, it is rated at 6000. You might be able to run it around 4600 to 5200 with 4 sticks

Best,
Muhammed

[super gnu]

ah i see you didnt use a 128gb kit, but two 64 gb ones? ive always been told that using two separate smaller kits is a bad idea. that would explain why i could not find a compatible kit

[Muhammed_Hamed]

Not ideal but I hope it will work fine, with DDR4 this used to be easier than now
Memory stability with DDR5 is a hit or a mess, probably the biggest issues of the AM5 platform. Some people are having issues even if they have an expensive Mobo and RAM kits

Best,
Muhammed

[super gnu]

well i swapped out my ram for 2x 64gb gskill ripjaw ddr5 6000 kits, i chose them because they were on the qvl list for the motherboard (in 2 dimm config) and were available here.

so far in a couple of tries, ive gone from 3600 max ram speed on the old ones, to 4600 on these new ones, with tighter timings too... seems stable but ive not tested thoroughly yet. however, wierdly, my vraybenchmark has gone down from 39800 to 38400. how confusing. id love to know how the scores of 43000 and even 46000 on the benchmark page were achieved. the reported clock speeds seem very similar to mine.

anyway ive also swapped out the noctua air cooler for a 280mm aio. this allows me to re-use the lovely CerberusX case i had my old machine in. i actually bought a normal atx case for this machine, but when i saw how much bigger it was than the Cerberus i couldnt bear to have it under my desk.

it all fits inside very nicely and airflow sems fine. component temps are all good. i do need to tidy up the cabling a bit but its not as bad as it looks.. the only limitation with the big radiator and push-pull 140mm fans at the front, is that i cant fit a gpu longer than 24cm in.. however since, if i want, i can get a 4070 TI super with 16gb in that length, and dont have any interest in gpu rendering, this is fine for me.

[rusteberg]

if you're using that 6TB thing at the bottom there to pull assets your working on from, then I'd highly recommend looking into an M.2 (separate from system allocated drive) to work from. You'll be amazed at how fast stuff loads (large scenes, asset directories, footage).

how is windows 11? Since we're all headed there

[super gnu]

if you're using that 6TB thing at the bottom there to pull assets your working on from, then I'd highly recommend looking into an M.2 (separate from system allocated drive) to work from. You'll be amazed at how fast stuff loads (large scenes, asset directories, footage).

no im not using that 6tb thing to pull assets from. thats my backup. ive got a pair of nvme drives in raid 0 (hidden under heatsinks on the motherboard) as my work and assets drive. i then use allways sync to mirror that to the spinny thing. - in my old machine the hdd was part of a raid mirrored pair for extra security (3 copies better than 2 eh?) but for now im just using one of them here.

[super gnu]

windows 11 is.... windows? tbf i immediately found an app that returns the start menu to win10 style, just because my muscle memory likes the power button to be on the bottom left of the menu, at the edge of the screen.
They have moved it to the right of the start menu, which is 1/3rd of the way across the screen. Didnt like that.. Nope.

apart from a few ui annoyances its fine. (dragging a window to the top of the screen no longer just maximises it, it opens a kind of drop down with window arrangement choices in) however ill get used to that stuff im sure.. it might even turn out better. regarding stability , no complaints so far, speed wise i cant compare cos its a new machine, never seen it in 10 before.