Per Square Foot

[glorybound]

Has anybody tried charging per square foot? Back in the day, hand renderings, I had a square foot range that worked well. Any thoughts?

[glorybound]

Price

Like this:
http://www.photorenderings.net/viz/prices.pdf

[jonahhawk]

With prices that low, Europe can start outsourcing render work to the U.S. instead of China.

[crazy homeless guy]

With prices that low, Europe can start outsourcing render work to the U.S. instead of China.

Look at the quality. You get what you pay for.

[glorybound]

price

I think he does great work, but it is hand drawn. A 3D image would cost more, but you can get more. I am thinking like $0.25 per square foot. When I bid a job I usually get prelims and I usually get information fed to me when I start showing them the mass model. I don't think it is practicable to ask for all the information before I start since most of that information is decided on based on my model.

Or am I not being wise and should I start charging for all those changes?

[EricCamper]

I found it almost impossible to come up with a sq ft number. How far do they want to go with the model...Massing, detailed, etc... I mean I can whip out a small commercial building or home in no time, but if I have to draw a lot of trim, site, cut up the model with bolleans and whatever, it can be tedious to say the least. I show my clients several different options..Massing cardboard to understand the model, then a splash of color, then materials and full blown model...I hate when I throw out a number like $3000 and they go %^#$. BUt If you start out with a shopping list of things, they can pick and choose....Oh...and always add another 100 percent.

[jonahhawk]

Yeah, take your best estimate, double it and add 15%. You might make more than $10/hr.

I think it is a good idea to be very clear about limitations and changes. If the view changes, the fee changes. You can put so much work into an image in post....

Well there is so much to look out for. I personally could never charge by the square foot. I have to see how much detail there is to model and how much landscaping is required. The site work is a project unto itself.

[Morne]

I always tell clients it depends on detail. You can do a simple little reception for next to nothing. But take the same space and have a high-tech design with loads of detail and the price can easily go up 3 times!

[EricCamper]

Plus...I starting thinking...If someone came to you and wanted to 3d model a small 1500 sq ft addition...That would only be $375... So just be weary of putting a sq ft price out there...I have a small portfolio that I send out and I have all the proposals and billing for each project...So someone can say...Hey...I like this one...How much did THAT cost? Then I can give them a comparision and some different options...

[glorybound]

Starving Artists

I can pretty accurately look at a set of sketches or drawings and set a price to it, but as the design changes so does my model. Are you guys charging for all these changes? Are you creating some sort of RFI's? I am working on a project now that changes daily and it is usually because they feed me information as they think I need it. The drawing might show a light fixture, but they are using a generic fixture in the drawings when they actually have a cut sheet with the actual fixture. The client sees the renderings and makes decisions based on rendering so do I keep billing? Is it realistic to say send me all the information and then I'll start and every change you make I'll send you a bill. Shouldn't our service be part of the process?

I don't want to play games with my client and my goal isn't to make a buck. I don't want to quote a low price to get the job just to start adding fees left and right so at the end of the day I have an un-happy client and an image that they paid to much for?

Just thoughts...

[andrewjohn81]

I agree. I wouldn't have any set fees at all. Take a look at each individual project, estimate the time and multiply that by whatever your hourly is.
They sometimes ask where you got the price. Tell them based off the requested specifications I estimated the job to be X amount of man hours at our hourly rate of X$.
But do mention any changes adds man hours and thus the price goes up.

We've dropped clients because they give us a quote of 7 grand, then with just a couple small changes the final price they try and quote 12. I think they sometimes fail to notice that we do the same thing so we know how the billing should work out. Just quote the job honestly, and charge the extra for the work done and not a huge amount extra.

We had some modeling done once and they did a bunch of extra models we didn't ask for, but they charged us for them so they could meet their full quota. We don't use them anymore. We noticed and were Not pleased.

[glorybound]

Price

What about percentage of total construction cost? The construction cost is based on complexity and building type. If the architect charges, let us say 10%, why can't we charge 1.5%?

100,000.00 building would be $1,500
200,000.00 building would be $3,000
400,000.00 building would be $6,000

or even a flexible scale so the larger the project the lower percentage?

There has to be a reliable equation.

[jonahhawk]

again, not such a good idea IMO. It just doesn't work out the same as an architect's billing. 1.5% is a huge fee!!! Good architects get around 7% and I know some who end up making around 2 or less.

So on a $120m job, you would get almost 2 million dollars for the renderings???

Have a look at the last job you did. Figure out how long it took you. Figure out some sort of salary for yourself. Figure how many of those jobs you need to survive per year. If you can come up with some sort of hourly rate for your time and then get a good feel for how long it takes you to complete a job, you have a good starting point for an estimate.

I know at companies like the one I work for, we get billed out way over what we are paid. Around $100/hr. I've put hundreds of hours in on some jobs...

have a look at the salary survey at cgarchitect.com
http://www.cgarchitect.com/vb/attach...5&d=1145246156

[EricCamper]

Yeah..My billing rate was $85.00 for the longest time and now we moved it to $105. COnsidering our Architects and senior engineers pull in over $195/hr. that's pretty good.

As far as the changes goes...I know what you mean...I quoted an animation/dvd virtual tour thing, that was SUPPOSE to be all massing!!! With NO VOICE, and in the end, I did all of that and more...BUT, I did not bill, cause I see more in the future. If you take the time to populate a room with furniture per a generic plan and then they give you specific brands, designs and etc...Estimate how much and then send them a Change order of some kind...This can usually be done via email with a "Ok to proceed" confirmation. Be fair, but don't work for free!!! I am not sure what your overhead percentage is, but there is a fine line somewhere, where you start to LOSE money...

[glorybound]

fee

7%? We are getting 15%. How can an architect take on the liability at 7%.