Map size changes when merging into scene with different scene units.

[Vizioen]

I'm in the process to change a template file I built in cm to meters. When importing the following maps change, but inconsistently.

So when merging,

VrayEdgesTex: is multiplied by 100 (2cm becomes 2 meters)
VrayTriplanarTex: is divided by 100 (200cm becomes 0.02 meters)
VrayDirt: is divided by 100 (200cm becomes 0.02 meters)
VrayColor2Bump: is divided by 100 (200cm becomes 0.02 meters)

I haven't checked out the other maps like VrayDistanceTex or whichever applies on Real World Unit sizes. Not sure if you can solve the whole scaling issue with all the maps but it's weird that different maps have different results actually.

[vladimir_krastev]

Hi, thanks for posting.
I did a few tests with VRayEdgesTex, VRayTriplanarTex, VRayDirt and VRayColor2Bump.
I created the scenes in centimetres and rendered and after that set my 3ds Max's units to meters and started merging and rendering again.

Below are the results for original state and after merge for VRayEdgesTex and VRayTriplanarTex

[vladimir_krastev]

And here is the results for original state and after merge for VRayDirt and VRayColor2Bump

[Vizioen]

That's strange, I haven't tested rendering with the values that were the result of the merge, but I'm going to recheck this. Will keep you posted. Thanks for replying and testing.

[Vizioen]

Ok so I investigated this matter and it's a little more weird than I described at first and the results are somewhat different (which is weird because last time I checked it did different things). And with two different outcomes depending on how you merge the material.

Anyway I recorded a video here: https://youtu.be/TIc1MVUaefE and I attached the mat file to this post:

I have a scene in centimeters and I created the following vray maps where you can input sizes:

VrayDirt
VrayCurvature
VrayDistanceTex
VrayColor2Bump
VrayNoiseTex (this one is missing QT I think as it loads slower)
VrayTriplanarTex
VrayEdgesTex

I then specified the size as 500 (except 100 for the EdgesTex as that is the maximum).

I saved this mat, then reset (back to cm), then changed the units (back to meters). Then dragged the mat file into the slate. When checking if the sizes are correct these ones are incorrect. All of them are multiplied by 100.
VrayCurvature
VrayColor2Bump
VrayTriplanarTex
VrayEdgesTex

What strikes me is that the fields that have the units inside (cm in this case) are all messed up when importing this way. All the fields of the other maps that have no units inside the fields are correctly scaled (at least the correct numbers, don't know about the rendering part, I didn't test that). The same problem occurs when I use connecter for instance to load a mat file into 3dsMax

---

I then reset my scene back to cm, drew a box and applied this material, and used copitor (which is basically save selected) to save this box. I reset my scene and changed the units to meters and pasted the box with copitor back in this scene.

Results are different this time only VrayEdgesTex displays the units multiplied by 100.

I tried with native save select and native merge and the results are the same. VrayEdgesTex is multiplied by 100.

---

So two different cases of importing the material with two different outcomes.

Can this be fixed please, or is this an Autodesk thing? Quite annoying as I'm working more and more in two different units.

3dsmax 2023.3 and Vray 6.1 (although I had this in 2022 and Vray 6.0 as well)

[Vizioen]

vladimir_krastev were you able to reproduce this issue? It's quite annoying as all my materials are built with centimeters and I have a lot of scenes in meters now. I wouldn't want to duplicate and mass change my 100s of materials to meters. Thank you!

[vladimir_krastev]

HI, I tested everything you showed but could not reproduce an issue. All values remain correct. I noticed that after you did a reset, it seems there is a non default (not empty) scene loaded.
Anyway on my setup I could not reproduce an issue. If you think it would be more productive we could also meet in a team viewer session. Please open a ticket for this using the contact form.

[Vizioen]

HI, I tested everything you showed but could not reproduce an issue. All values remain correct. I noticed that after you did a reset, it seems there is a non default (not empty) scene loaded.
Anyway on my setup I could not reproduce an issue. If you think it would be more productive we could also meet in a team viewer session. Please open a ticket for this using the contact form.

Very strange. I always start from templates. The scene that is loading is a scene in centimeters. This shouldn't matter no? I have all the same issues in all my scenes, which started from some templates. I'll see if a default scene makes any difference. I'll see if I find the time for the teamviewer session. A few deadlines first.

[Vizioen]

I tested this with standard template too and no difference. vladimir_krastev did you test the mat file I send you?

So basically you start from a clean scene, you set the scene units to meters (leave the display scale at cm), then you import the mat file that I've attached to the previous post.

Can you compare the values that you see in those maps, to what you see when you open them in a fresh scene put to centimeters (in which they are made).

[vladimir_krastev]

Hi, Vizioen I will have to review the thread and test again since it has been a while. I remember only that I repeated all steps as you explained but I can't recall if I used your .mat file or not. I will test again hopefully by the end of the day.

[vladimir_krastev]

After testing I still can not find an issue. I opened two 3ds Max instances one with system units in centimetres, one in meters and display units both in centimetres. Created a box in the cm one, applied your material and rendered. Then saved the box as scene and merged into the other 3ds Max and rendered. The results are identical. Overall the results are the same as with my initial tests.

[Vizioen]

Hi thanks for testing. Your screenshots say otherwise, look at your values. They are multiplied by a 100, they should be the same value as your display units are the same. And that's exactly what happens in the render too. The material I send you was not for testing in a render as there are no maps, so you can't really see the problem. With me the problems are defintely there with materials with maps or anything.

In any case, if a triplanar map goes from 500 to 50000 and the edgestex from 100 to 10000, something is wrong. So you just confirmed that you have the same issue.

[vladimir_krastev]

Hi, we managed to look into this thread a bit more thoroughly. You are correct that something is not right. We will investigate the issue and get back to you.

[Vizioen]

Awesome. Thanks for taking the time. It's very strange behaviour especially with the two different types of outcome depending on how you import the mat. I had to reread my posts too as I forgot about that one...

[vladimir_krastev]

Hi Vizioen the issue is reported under VMAX-13562. Thanks for bringing it to attention and for cooperation during the process of testing. You were of great help.