New Version: So Many Frustrations

[steelers05]

First I want to say that I am not starting this thread to bitch at the developers and I dont want the thread to be turning into that, but I also need to get a few problems out there because the new version is almost becoming unworkable for me to even use.

The bigges problem I am having is I will be working with a file and it works fine, but then reopen it just a few minutes later and several of my materials have their names changed and the rendering wont even start again. The renderings not starting was a problem with old models from past version, but this time I was using a new model and it worked at first but then did as I was saying and wont start rendering.

Another problem is that, I am importing models into my scenes with textures already applied and I go to preview them in the material editor and they often either dont show up or it crashes the entire program.

With this new file I have been working on...the original version will not render, but if I import it into an entirely new file it somehow seems to work, but then after I save it again and reopen it, it wont render like I previously explained.

I really dont know what to do at this point. Am i going to have to go back and reconfigure my entire library of imported 3d models so that they will work in this new version. I really hope not. Im completely affraid to even start a new project with this new version, because it feels so unstable.

The user interface also seems to be a lot slower and lag.

I am not trying to cause an uprise on the forum because I totally understand the small team that is working on the product and I know you always get pressure for new releases to come out as soon as possible, but is it reasonable to expect a bug fix that will make this version as stable as the last one to be coming out sometime withing the next few weeks?

There are several other issues that arent coming to mind yet and will continue to post them to hopefully help the developers.

Lastly, I am running SU7 on a 64bit windows 7 machine...could this be causing any of the problems?

[steelers05]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

came into work and noticed another issue....I had to reimport my scene into a new file to start with and I renderd my scene over night and it worked, but then I came into work (kept the same file open that I rendered over night), made a quick adjustment to a few lights in my scene and tried to render again and got the same problem as before where the rendering never even starts...I just click the "R" to render and the button stays "active" or "pushed down" for a few seconds and then my computer just goes back to my scene without ever starting the rendering. So I saved my file and did like before and imported this file into a new SU7 file and the rendering starts up again and actually renders.

Also, I do not think the glossy effects option in the global switches menu works....I unchecked the option for a test render and anticipated all of my blurry reflections to not render as blurry but they still ended up rendering blurry. That another option that I hope is going to be fixed in the next update because it is vital to my workflow and im sure many others.

[dkendig]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

steelers05- Thank you for giving us a heads up about your issues. We are trying our best to fix any bugs we hear about. We are actually holding off on releasing a patch until we can fix the DR issue, and we want to fix any bugs we can find in between. We need to have the product in much better shape after this patch. Just to note, it is easier to track these issues, if they are able to be separated in to one post for each bug. I have been manually creating bug reports for the issues on our forum, and then linking to the forum posts for each bug. Now that I've said that... I guess I'll respond to each issue inline, lol. How ironic.

The bigges problem I am having is I will be working with a file and it works fine, but then reopen it just a few minutes later and several of my materials have their names changed and the rendering wont even start again. The renderings not starting was a problem with old models from past version, but this time I was using a new model and it worked at first but then did as I was saying and wont start rendering.

I have not heard of materials renaming themselves... this is concerning! Do you have an example scene that we could use to reproduce the issue? Or perhaps, would it be possible to record a video of this happening, using Jing, or some other software? Sometimes a video can reveal something that our troubleshooting will miss. As far as the issue of the render not starting after clicking the render button, I assume that this would be related to the material rename issue. If the materials are being renamed, then there may be a desynchronization between SU's material editor, and the V-Ray material editor. This would result in a key error in your VfS error log, mentioning the name of the offending material. Posting a copy of your error log after this issue occurs would allow us to clearly see if that was the issue.

Another problem is that, I am importing models into my scenes with textures already applied and I go to preview them in the material editor and they often either dont show up or it crashes the entire program.

Where are you importing these models from, and how are you importing them. Are you actually using the import option in the SU file menu? Are you getting from 3D warehouse? Are you drag and dropping them in to the SU scene? Are you copy and pasting between SU windows? A bit more detail, or a video of this issue would help us diagnose this further. Also, do the models that you're importing in to the scene have V-Ray materials applied to them? You are able to import models that already have V-Ray material data attached to them. It may be possible that there is some sort of desync that is going on, much like the previous issue. A copy of your error log after this error occurs would be useful in diagnosing this issue too. Have you tried running any of the debugging tools on this scene to see if that does anything?

Am i going to have to go back and reconfigure my entire library of imported 3d models so that they will work in this new version. I really hope not.

Our goal is to have this version able to understand older scenes without having our users go through any extra steps. We really don't want users to be forced to rework their entire workflow for this version. That's why we tried to keep it looking pretty much the same as our last version. We didn't want anyone to get too lost when looking at the new UI. Please let us know about any issues you encounter using your old scenes and materials.

The user interface also seems to be a lot slower and lag.

The UI has all been redone, so there is a very powerful beast hiding beneath it's ugly exterior. We plan on harnessing that power in an upcoming release. Until then we will try to make our UI more responsive, but I wouldn't expect it to be much more snappy after the patch. I know this is a workflow issue, and we are trying our best to streamline things as much as we can.

I am not trying to cause an uprise on the forum because I totally understand the small team that is working on the product and I know you always get pressure for new releases to come out as soon as possible, but is it reasonable to expect a bug fix that will make this version as stable as the last one to be coming out sometime withing the next few weeks?

The only reason I'm on this forum at all, is to find issues like the ones you're talking about, and fix them. So trust me, this isn't seen as any sort of slap to the face. We know the software is "riddled with bugs" as one users so eloquently put it. We were given a false sense of security by our testing. We opened our doors to hundreds of users, but we got very little feedback. The feedback we got, apparently was not complete, which is unfortunate at best. As a result, you now have a version of VfS that is a bit buggy. We are waiting for a fix for the DR issue from the chaos group. Once we have that fix in place, we will likely be releasing the patch. In the meantime, we are going to be going around fixing whatever we can. After the patch is put out, we will begin V-Ray for Rhino development. During that development cycle, changes will likely be made to VfS also, and another patch or version will be released after V-Ray for Rhino. It all depends on what changes are made, and how well they mesh with our VfS plugin. We hope that this next patch will not take much longer, but unfortunately we can't give any more exact of a release date than by the end of the month. That's the plan anyway. You know what they say about the best made plans of mice and men though...

Also, I do not think the glossy effects option in the global switches menu works....I unchecked the option for a test render and anticipated all of my blurry reflections to not render as blurry but they still ended up rendering blurry.

DING! you found a new bug, thank you!

There are several other issues that arent coming to mind yet and will continue to post them to hopefully help the developers.

Please do!

[dkendig]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

That super long post is another reason it's useful to have each bug in it's own thread. Not to mention the 10-20 people that will most likely say "THAT'S THE EXACT SAME ISSUE I HAVE!!!" and start posting about various issues they're having in this thread (I'm just waiting for it... I know someone's going to do it). It just ends up as a jumbled mess by the end of it all. Then again, I'd rather get a jumbled bug report than no bug report at all. ::shrugs::

[steelers05]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

dkendig, thanks for the in quick, detailed response. I will mal all this over this weekend and try to get back to you with more in depth explanations. Until then, good luck with all the fixes...I know you are guys are working hard to make vray the best it can be and I am appreciatize of that.

[dkendig]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

Sounds good, please keep us posted.

[gallystops]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

To limit myself from giving examples of a number of these issues i will just say that...

with the materials renaming themselves. Its a major issue with me too. I import a .vismat and it either takes on an existing materials name or completely replaces an existing one...

example.

I have 4 materials

-red
-blue
-wood
-water

and i import a metal it will look like one of these two things

-red
-wood
-wood
-water

And one of those woods will be the metal.

-red
-blue
-water

And the wood will be deleted, or i should say replaced.


My other concern is material previews going gray and having to relink the jpegs. Usually happens when i close and re open a file.

I am sorry i dont have my log or file on my at work at the moment but when i run into the issue again i will Screenshot and error log it. I know you guys need this info


-Gallystops-

[steelers05]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

Ok after playing a bit more this weekend, I am going to elaborate on my problem and discuss a few new ones.

First, a few new problems ive encounter:

1. The frame buffer does not seem to save jpeg files, or at least they dont go to the proper location and I cant find them anywhere. The only other file type ive tried are .png files and they seem to work fine.

2. There are a few procedural maps that dont seem to work or even show up in the material preview window. One in particular is the "Texstucco". Ive tried activiating for a bump map and I cant even preview it in the material editor and it doesnt seem to even work as my bump map. I did little testing but the few times I did try, I had no succes.

3. I have experienced most of my crashes when activating and going to select bump and displacement maps. I wouldnt say it is often, but I have had times where I try to activate and a select a bump/disp. map and it just completely shuts down SU.

Now to further elaborate on the biggest problem I am seeing. Unfortunately I do not have the opportunity to make a video of this at work so this is the best way I can explain everything.
So I start by working on my model and I will set up all of my materials and settings and I will be working for about an hour and everything will be running smoothly and I am able to render my models perfectly. Then after about an hour or so of work, I will go to render my model again and I am having the same problem a lot people have been complaining about and my scene wont render. I hit the "R" button to render and it acts like its thinking for a minute or so and then nothing happens in vray. SU doesnt crash, it just goes back to a workable viewport without the rendering ever starting. Its like there is some sort of memory leak or something, because I have also renderd things over night and came in the next morning and tried rendering the exact same thing and it wont start up again.
So, I save my file and I reopen it thinking the program just needs restarted, but when I go to render the scene, it still wont start the rendering. As a result, i tried my own test and I opened a completely fresh, new SU file and I imported my model into this new scene using "file" then "import". I import this model with all my lights and textures and hit render and for some reason this works. My scene renders and most all of the materials work, but that brings me to the next problem. Most, not all, of my materials work. A few that I know of that I had problems with were ones that were just SU colors that either had a reflection or emissive layer applied to them. I would set them up, but when import my model into my new scene they lose their reflective/emissive layer and I would keep having to go back and reset them up. Im not sure why it does this but could it have anything to do with the naming convention? For example, the names of the ones that gave me probelems were "black glossy, white glossy, black matte, purple emissive" I think that was all of them.

With all that said, I must say, I am so happy with the new release and the way it just handled everything else. It seems like the program is much better at handling SU models and I honestly only had to make two adjustments to the rendering options to get proper settings for my day time scene. Everything was more predictable and I feel like I have more control with this release. I could be wrong, but the new version also seems to eliminate a lot more noise in renderings, even with lower settings. Also, it seems to smoothe models out better when rendering and you dont get as many segmented looking objects for organic models...am I making this up? Anyways, just working with the program this weekend has made me so confident, that this version is going to be amazing as soon as all these little bugs are out of the way. Keep up the work guys..cant wait for the new fix.

[ozzimasi]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations


"To limit myself from giving examples of a number of these issues i will just say that..."

oh I have this:
I apply bump map and reflaction map on a material, I render the scene, it works fine,
I save the work, I re open the work: bye by bump and reflection maps.
I work with skup 6 and Vray 1.05.30 (the 1.48.66 had too many bugs...)
but somebody told me not to be nervous...

[omegaslasher]

Re: New Version: So Many Frustrations

Noticed a new Bug this evening. In the VFB, DO NOT click on the "F" button to change the font if you value the rendering you just finished. Clicking on this button in the VFB is an instant bugsplat--so BEWARE!