Multipass Denoiser performance 2017 vs 2020

[sirio76]

Hello,

I apologize for the delayed reply.

We are still looking for the reason for this. The change has happened quite a long time ago and we are looking where the problem is. We will let you know if we have any updates.

Hi Aleksandar,
any news about the issue? if needed I can provide files for both Vray 5 and 3.7, this problem should have high priority because without a good denoiser the only way to get clean renders it to lower the threshold a lot with a large increase in render time.

[RwVision]

Hello,

I apologize for the delayed reply.

We are still looking for the reason for this. The change has happened quite a long time ago and we are looking where the problem is. We will let you know if we have any updates.

Hi Aleksandar,

Need to also bump this up - 3 months and nothing?
I believe that Vray denoiser is the same for all softwares, so I can't even imagine how anyone is using it - And why no one saw the problem?

[piotrus3333]

Hi.
have you gave nvidia AI denoiser a try?

[RwVision]

Yes, and it does not come near the old multipass performance.

Nvidia AI isn't available as a standalone solution, capable of animation handling also.

[piotrus3333]

true, its not recommended for animation but I did test it on little interior scene and it worked surprisingly well. it does have limitations but I find it much better than VRayDenoiser.

[RwVision]

true, its not recommended for animation but I did test it on little interior scene and it worked surprisingly well. it does have limitations but I find it much better than VRayDenoiser.

There you have it - Current denoiser is worse than Nvidia. Where old, true multipass denoiser was better than both.

If you can, please make a 32bit, vrimg file with denoiser pass. I will compare it and post on both denoisers.

Also - Current projects I'm working on need to be done in old 3.7 so NV denoiser is whole another topic.

[piotrus3333]

sending via pm.

[RwVision]

shaio Please give us an update on the denoiser - why this is still not corrected?

[RwVision]

Hi,

shaio
aleksandar.kasabov

Why there's no feedback on the denoiser performance?

[sirio76]

+1
even something like "we are working on this" would be useful

[vlado]

The multipass denoiser mode was removed because it caused issues with reflections and refractions (with "affect channels" enabled, these effects were effectively doubled). For the few years since it was removed, nobody has complained about it until now.

To achieve something similar with the new denoisers, you can add manually the needed elements, turn on denoising only for the ones that you want (e.g. lighting or GI or reflections) and then composite the result in the new VFB. It's more clicks for sure, and it's something that we can definitely try to make more convenient. On the plus side, this should work with all the different denoiser engines.

Best regards,
Vlado

[sirio76]

The multipass denoiser mode was removed because it caused issues with reflections and refractions (with "affect channels" enabled, these effects were effectively doubled). For the few years since it was removed, nobody has complained about it until now.

To achieve something similar with the new denoisers, you can add manually the needed elements, turn on denoising only for the ones that you want (e.g. lighting or GI or reflections) and then composite the result in the new VFB. It's more clicks for sure, and it's something that we can definitely try to make more convenient. On the plus side, this should work with all the different denoiser engines.

Best regards,
Vlado

Thanks Vlado, I'll try this option as soon as I have some spare time, but the problem is that even the V5 standard method (called RGB denoiser on the 3.7) is not working correctly. I've posted some images on this topic: https://forums.chaosgroup.com/forum/...-store-concept as you can see what you get now is a blurry render like if the texture filter, world normal and other channels are not taken in to account. In this version denoiser it's barely usable (not because we lack the option for denoising multiple render element separately) and because of that the only option is to use lower threshold resulting in unnecessary long render time, so please check what's happening, I'm available for any test and if needed I can provide scenes

[RwVision]

The multipass denoiser mode was removed because it caused issues with reflections and refractions (with "affect channels" enabled, these effects were effectively doubled). For the few years since it was removed, nobody has complained about it until now.

To achieve something similar with the new denoisers, you can add manually the needed elements, turn on denoising only for the ones that you want (e.g. lighting or GI or reflections) and then composite the result in the new VFB. It's more clicks for sure, and it's something that we can definitely try to make more convenient. On the plus side, this should work with all the different denoiser engines.

Best regards,
Vlado

Thanks for the input. To this day I'm using the old standalone denoiser, which can do multipass. Shaio did even get me the latest build, which still did it.
I was using it only for animations, so I don't even bother trying the method you subscribed. Last time I remember, the new denoiser totally missed the mp denoising.

I honestly can't believe, that so powerful denoiser was turned into a blurish mess - and no one complains

On March Shaio wrote to me - "I can confirm that the Multipass (render elements) part of the denoiser doesn't work as before and this affects the denoiser on the other integrations as well, so we will be looking in to it."
So I do believe that the problem is known and does not need any more explanations to fix/update the denoiser.

[RwVision]

Hello aleksandar.kasabov ,
shaio ?

Still no updates? Does anyone even bother with this?

[sirio76]

For now I given up using the standard denoiser... I'm always using the Intel one and it does a decent job, that been said I really hope they will fix the standard because it was superior for the reflection glossiness details.