Blend Material - Help Please

[scarabrae]

Hi Guys

I have been trying to get my blend material to work without success. Basically I have a base material that works fine as well as another material with my dirt map AND mask from Mari. I've had a play without success so ended up recording a quick screen capture video to describe where I'm stuck. I've had a look at the docs yet unable to figure out what I need to do. If you have a moment, would you please have a look and point out what I can do to come up with a solution?

Cheers

Pete

[Muhammed_Hamed]

Place your mask(Vblend amount 1) on top of the blend material. It should work now..and if it didn't work I think you will have to use Schematic to setup the relations(cannot remember sorry and I'm not by my PC)
For me personally I prefer schematic for every blend material setup. Just place the blend material on top of everything in the material group and you can now connect the nodes in schematic easily.
Also it is better to place everything in one group because this blend material up top in your shader tree will affect everything in the scene.
Here is a tutorial I did on Vray blend. It should help you understand how schematic works.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBhSiyVsEow
And here a complex schematic setup using Blend material. It will help you understand many things.
https://forums.chaosgroup.com/forum/...do-scene-files
And here is another example with stochastic flakes
https://forums.chaosgroup.com/forum/...flakes-in-modo
You will get used to this workflow very quickly. If you still need help upload the scene and I will fix it for you.

[Robert]

Yeah the blend nodes are also a bit painful. Basically you should do all in schematic and collect the nodes in a group below (so you don't loose them).
Main down point with schematic is that you can only use V-Ray nodes. Its all there, but the procedurals are not as fine as in Modo.
Another problem is that schematic has no thumbnail preview for the nodes, so you bit blind to what you do if you not render them (there is an option to show the texture in render preview).

[scarabrae]

Hi Muhammed. These links are really useful and no doubt will go over them again and again picking up workflow hints. As it stands ,watching your Layered plastic video helped. I can see how I need to re-think my thinking a bit from modo's way of using Group and Layer masks to build a more complicated shaders. Thanks once again. Pete

Hi Robert. I've ever only worked in schematic during some rigging a while back. I loved the node tree in Softimage. I took an age to get my head around Modo's Render Tree....seems like I need to shift my take again to the graph way of working.

Cheers Guys.

[Muhammed_Hamed]

I can see how I need to re-think my thinking a bit from modo's way of using Group and Layer masks to build a more complicated shaders.
.

Working with schematic is easier than what you think. It is not different than what you used to do in Softimage. It will take like a day or 2 of experimenting and you will know everything about it.
Like what Robert said the biggest problem with Modo is that there is no thumbnail previews,but the texture isolate in Modo does very good job with schematic or shader tree. It is even an advantage for me as I always see how the scale and tiling of textures look on my objects,while in C4d I used to be lazy and use the thumbnail previews all the time to do the changes without making sure the scale and tiling are 100% correct(It was pain to setup a light material every time I want to see the tiling on an object).

@ robert I think all the nodes work fine with schematic,The native Modo ones that are supported. I use many of them. Even the native color blend and color correct nudes that don't appear in shader tree.
Compared to Vray in Maya or Max,I think the blend material is not painful at all. It works the same for the most part. I use schematic for most of my materials and it works perfectly.

[MartinBrinks]

Hi Scarabrae - I'm also stuck with the blend material. Despite Muhammed's generous help, I'm still not getting it (too stressed at the moment for in depth schematic learning). Is the blend material meant to be at the top of the shader with the sub-materials placed in Groups below - each with a vblend at the top of the group?

[scarabrae]

Cheers again, Muhammed...'texture isolate', I'll take a look.

Martin, I think it does matter in the shader tree view where the Blend Node sits relative to the other materials. Looks like the Texture Mask or Node driving the Blend amount can sit above the Blend Material node, but the Base and Coat Materials do need to sit below the Blend Material in the tree view.

I have to agree with Muhammed, the Schematic just seems the way to go, but that'll be personal preference I suppose.

I've made a short video demonstrating my current level of understanding. I may have got it right or wrong! But it'll at least get you going and have a play.

[Muhammed_Hamed]

@Pete Thanks for the video. You got it right. If you are using schematic you don't need to place the mask on top of the blend. Always place the blend on top of everything and don't worry about placing any textures or coats below the blend(order of anything below the blend material doesn't have any effect). Also this works with any material not just the blend material. Let's say you are using a flakes material or the usual Vray material with schematic. Place it on top of all textures and don't worry about the order of textures below it.

@Martin if you are using Schematic,just place the blend material on top of everything else like what Pete did in the video. You don't need to put the mask on top. If you are not using schematic,place the mask on top of the blend,but you will not be able to apply textures to the base and coat materials,it will not work unless you use schematic. Also schematic is very easy,it works like any node based system in Maya,Max..etc
I will make couple of videos this week on schematic hopefully with more examples.

[Muhammed_Hamed]

And here are 2 videos about texture isolate by Vladimir
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkASpe7Bv6o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD7gesuMLaU

[scarabrae]

I will make couple of videos this week on schematic hopefully with more examples.

That'll be useful, thanks.

Texture Isolate links- now that will be helpful.

[MartinBrinks]

Thanks both of you, it all makes good sense now. I've spent the last two years with Max, so the schematics are great and definitely the way to go. Earlier today I was just so stressed out the mere thought of trying it was way out of my comfort zone.

[scarabrae]

Earlier today I was just so stressed out the mere thought of trying it was way out of my comfort zone.

Some great research from neuroscience about that being a great place to be to learn

[MartinBrinks]

Ha, probably right - but when you're in the thick of it all you sense is fatigue and despair. But I got into schematics, which is a big thing

[scarabrae]

Cant see your image, Martin...just the place holder icon.

Personally, I used to struggle and not ask for help until I realised it was okay, so that was my learning

[reclaimer1]

I would love to see the Grant Warwick rust tutorial updated as it scares the hell out of me fantastic info Muhammed_Hamed thanks for making the videos