I know this topic 's been “the hot topic” in many occasions, but it is never clear enough, at least for me!
It’s been quite a long time since I haven’t done any corporate/office building modeling/rendering so I don’t know how much a possible competitor could be charging or the amount of hours this work could take me!
It is a 12 stories building: 4 parking floors and 8 office floors, located in South Florida and the client asked me for a quick estimate.
Could you give me any clue on how much for the first exterior rendering and how much for any additional ones, please?
What amount $$$could be kind of average for CG market for this particular case?
Thanks a lot!
$5000 and $3000 if you are good. $2000 and $1500 if you are ok and it is a quick and dirty job. $500 if you are in china (cost of living is that much less there).
or,
you could actually calculate what it COSTS you to make this end product and charge accordingly.
i have never been one to subscrbe to arbitrary pricing, particularly when given by people who are not in your market. not to say that cpnichols price is arbitray to himself, but to someone living on the other side of the world, with most likely entirely different overhead structures, it is more or less meaningless.
try to find out exactly what you need to spend to create this work. figure out what you want on top of that. then bill that price. everything costs you money, your software, hardware, office/house, phone, prints, driving to see the client, etc, etc, etc… dont just blindly create prices without at least knowing if you can handle the concequences (starving yourself may well be one of them)
there isnt going to be any fixed dollar value for what a viz/model/animation/render is worth. not even in the same area. picking $5000 “cause i’m good and i think its worth $5000 cause this person said so” can generally lead to disaster, either by losing cash cause it wasnt enough in the end, or losing the job because it may well have been “worth” only $99 to the client.
hell, i’ve charged $5000 just to re-render someone elses crappy viz. and on the other side, ive charged $1000 for an animated flythrough of an office building. i billed these according to how long they took, and ended out on top on both. if i were to have made up the prices just from asking “what someone else charges for a flythrough and a re-render” i’d have totally screwed myself on both counts, eating it on the re-render, and losing the fly through.
so, the moral of this story is, dont just pull pricing out of your ass. it will come back and kick it in the end.
damn, thats one lame moral 
later
Hi,
I may help you telling you that a company in Poitiers ,I live here(France) , did ask
about 4000 FF a half day (600 euros) to make architecture rendering and
maybe modelisation.
It didn’t work.
In Nice or somewhere not very far from there, another company did
propose its services in 3D… for 400 FF an hour (60euros)
When I started I proposed 26 euros an hour, then now I’m at 30 euros an hour.
Well It’s not enough, but life is very hard.
A residence costs 1000 euros more or less sometimes 1500euros.
A house costs about 500 euros.
People are not ready here to pay 1 or 4 images at that price.They don’t
really understand, it is “just” an image.
So, it’s not easy to find a good price when you don’t belong to a group.
You have to think to your taxes if you are honest, and it’s a huge part.
For instance, at the end of this year I do not have any money left, I had
to give about 4000 euros in different taxes. 
So There is no christmas this year.
Another important thing, if you’re not a dealer,like me, that’s a very bad point.I give too much service to make the customers happy without charge.
“Trop bon, trop con !”
It’s very difficult ! be carefull !
Bye !
Gael
if it’s your first building your going to be very, very slow.
say you need 1 week for it…if you were experienced with architectual rendering you’d need one day. that would be about 500-1000 EUR probably.
as gafl says, don’t expect to make huge money when you work for architects.
the number of images hardly plays any role, unless it’s a lot. it’s more important if you also need to render interiours, which can be quite some work. the requested detail is also something to consider.
As usual, these questions are all answered here:
Read all these articles, starting at the bottom and working your way up. Very very good advice and info on how to handle pricing, costs, dealing, contracts, etc.
holy crap im a student and when im out of school. im going to under cutt you greedy pll out.are you friging kiding me.no wunder the world is the way it is.(may god forgive you)
LOL fastdraw, hope you don’t eat much :lol:
holy crap im a student and when im out of school. im going to under cutt you greedy pll out.are you friging kiding me.no wunder the world is the way it is.(may god forgive you)
Good point… you’re a student 8) :? Maybe you should check this link before you try to get any werk www.spellcheck.net :lol:
--Jon
holy crap im a student and when im out of school. im going to under cutt you greedy pll out.are you friging kiding me.no wunder the world is the way it is.(may god forgive you)
read this link before making more of a fool out of yourself smartypants…
http://www.cgarchitect.com/upclose/article2\_DW.asp
and yes you are joe doe.
No wounder you all charge so match your client are paying for your
living expenses that’s crap.this is a art form not a service.
Price should be on your talent . Like all art work price and demand.
You type of pll make me sick you all expect every 1 else to pay for your crap. I drive a BMW so IM going to charge you 5000 buck for a 500 dollar job give me a break.
.IM in school steel and published many projects.
Why is that you ask because I under cut you other pll.
I’ve payed off my student loan got a new car and now working on a house.
All from projects I’ve worked on. And the funny thing is I didn’t charge over 1000 for any of my work.see that’s the difference between me and you I love art work all kings . And think every 1 should be able to get it for a price
cheaper than you all money grabbing people charge.
See when I go to sleep @ night I sleep good cuss I know where IM going when I die. How well do you all sleep.
Dont be mad @ me because you all think your better then every 1 else.
No wounder you all charge so match your client are paying for your
living expenses that’s crap.this is a art form not a service.
Are hollywood movies an art form or a service? Are architectural water colors for a big box retail development so the developer can get his project past city hall art or a service? Is doing CG reconstructions of a crime scene art or a service? Is producing a commercial art or a service?
Get off your high horse and welcome to the real world. If you want to do “art”, then by all means, do your own art and try to sell it at art shows and the like. But when a client wants a visualization created of something that doesn’t really exist, that is a service. It may be art, but it is more importantly a service. The vast majority of us here are doing service work, not art. Zuliban’s work is art. My personal work is art. The renderings I have done of tract housing and custom housing, tv set design, movie teaser trailers, mutlimedia presentations, and animated studio logos have all been services. There is an art to them, but they are still services.
Yes, it is always a plus to be fortuneate enough that your work is something you love doing - awe inspiring results come of this. But it is still work, it is still a job, and you still need to get paid.
Should we all charge really low rates and go work at McDonalds to make up the difference we need in our living expenses? Or is working at McDonalds “art” as well.
Go back to your cave, troll.
So Y kNoT dEw It FeR FREE :?: :!: :?: :!: :twisted: :!: :evil: :roll:
--Jon
yeah, why not undercutting the price when you live with your mom, you mom pays the bills, your mom cooks, your mom buys you XBOX games etc… 
i am off to play Desert Combat. i am pissed off… :evil:
No wounder you all charge so match your client are paying for your
living expenses that’s crap.this is a art form not a service.
Price should be on your talent . Like all art work price and demand.
You type of pll make me sick you all expect every 1 else to pay for your crap. I drive a BMW so IM going to charge you 5000 buck for a 500 dollar job give me a break.
.IM in school steel and published many projects.
Why is that you ask because I under cut you other pll.
I’ve payed off my student loan got a new car and now working on a house.
All from projects I’ve worked on. And the funny thing is I didn’t charge over 1000 for any of my work.see that’s the difference between me and you I love art work all kings . And think every 1 should be able to get it for a price
cheaper than you all money grabbing people charge.
See when I go to sleep @ night I sleep good cuss I know where IM going when I die. How well do you all sleep.
Dont be mad @ me because you all think your better then every 1 else.
your little misspelled rant couldn’t be further from the truth. Raise your hands if you drive a bmw and live in a huge house…
The fact of the matter is that Im sure most of us make an average wage. Do you have any idea how much it costs to start a studio and keep it running? The thousands spend on software alone??? The thousands spent on hardware???
I think I can pretty much guarantee that you’ve burned your bridge here…move along…
BTW, love your flaming logos…they’re so… artsy…
I’ve seen your work fastfraw. There is no way that it could be called art. You have to have skills and talent to be considered an artist. Calling yourself one does not make it so!!
And if somenone actually paid you for the work you do, your the one that should be ashamed.
You claim to be 32 years old and your still in school? I can certainly see why. You really need it!
Ok, you have managed to get the nasty responces you were looking for from the members here. So now it’s time to move on to the next site and feed your sick since of humor there.
Tony
Jest the comment I would expect form your kind.
My mother was 45 when she finished collage
not every 1 has a silver spoon in there AZZ
And that’s your opinion to say that
im not going to say your work is not art .
see i say my opinion and you say bad things about me
now who is the bad person. you most not sleep well!
O_o
umm, well, i dont exactly know what to make of this. weather to be insulted, amused, disgusted.
asside from the obvious and afforementioned facts that you need to cover your expenses, which will vary from region to region, setup to setup, there are a few things i dont think you quite comprehend about running a business and perhaps life in general.
i live in toronto canada. toronto is one of the more expensive places to live in this country, but not so much so that you need to be rich to live here. it also happens to be one of the larger centres for computer graphics in the country, and the most affordable of the big three.
i’ll list of a few points that will quickly draw a “poverty line” if you ever want to get out of your mom’s basement.
1. the average small house in toronto costs about $320,000. the average small condo is $200,000. the average cost of a 2 bedroom small apartment is about $1000 per month. a 1 bedroom apartment is around $850 per month. utitities(water, electricity, heat) for those apartments may be included, or run up to $200 per month additional. houses will have at least that expense plus an aditional $2500 per year in property taxes.
2. the average monthly food bill for 1 adult who eats out once a week or so is about $300-$500 per month. if you starve yourself and eat KD every day, you might get off on $200. aditional expenses like TP, soap, laundry and the like might run over $100 per month depending on how fashion conscious you are.
3. clothing, though usually not a monthy predicatble expense can set you back a fair bit. especially if you are trying to impress larger clients. as a benchmark to compare to your area, a blank no name t-shirt runs about $20. a pair of levis 501’s are $70.
4. telephone service at its most basic is $26, with features and a bit of long distance calling it can creep up to the $100 mark fairly quickly. cable high speed internet access is $45 per month. cable tv will run $30-$50/month
5. if you can steal furniture and dishes from your parents, bonus, otherwise, even raiding ikea for the cheapest crap in the place can run you near $3000. trust me, i know, i just did it and thats just to do a small 1 bedroom place.
ok, there we go. we have all the things needed to live. i’ll assume in there you already have your basic pc for surfing. so lets see… $10,200 or more just for rent every year, an additional $4500 for generic expenses at minimum. oh, wait, forgot the 15% tax on that… $5175. thats $15375 at the absolute cheapest you can scrape by with. well, lets see, whats that before taxes. at 22% income tax, you need to have a salary of $18,750, or about $9.10 per hour 40 hours a week, 50 weeks a year. impressive huh? the average mcdonalds/walmart type emplyee here gets $7.50 per hour 20 hours or less per week. hey, you’ve clued in, micky dees isn’t a career.
so, where do we go from here. well, we need more money, i mean every cg worker has a bmw, i want one too. well, keep dreaming, cause you will need to be clearing at least tripple that to get one o them fancy new x-3’s. oh, your under 25 years old? make that quadruple cause they are gonna rape you for $5000 a year insurance on top of that $650 a month lease.
so we forget the beemer and decide to get just the basics. a more comfortable appartment in a less crime ridden area. some furniture your not affraid to sit on. a chair that wont land you in traction, and that all wonderful thing we have called a metropass. $100 a month just to ride the fricken bus!
we are now closer to about $38,000 (or just shy of $20 an hour) and since we jumped to a new tax bracket, the government wants to swipe 31% now. thats about $2185 every month in your pocket, all of which is spoken for before you even get to see it. lets hope you have an understanding girlfriend.
so, what IS your job anyway? if we are working in a nice comfy studio, using someone elses equipment, this really isnt so bad off. you could do alot worse. you dont have a car and aren’t saving anything though. that house of your own is a distant dream.
i know! how bout i open my own studio. i’ll do it from home to save cash on rent, and use my existing PC afforded to me by my better $38,000 a year salary. all i gotta do is buy software. oh the pain. $4400 for 3d stuio max!!! $900 for photoshop! oh, damn, this feature sucks, i need to buy (insert plugin product here). you mean i have to edit my own stuff? damn, there goes another $2000 for premire and AE. now, much of this aids in reducing your taxes, but you still gotta shell it out up front.
throw in printing, transportation to see clients (they sure as hell ain’t coming to your cramped little apartment), cel phone and all the miscelaneous stuff that goes with this business, and you’ll find yourself with a nice $10,000 + credit card nightmare.
you very quickly find yourself wanting your old job back. needing to earn now near $50,000 (with another 4% stolen by the tax man, and btw, ontario has the lowest taxes in canada) just to accomplish the SAME thing. you still havent got your car, your girlfriend left you cause you work 16 hours a day and cant buy here presents. and you bank account constantly reads 0.
i think anyone with half a brain can figure out the rest of this story. i wont bother typing it out. that and i’m hungry. sufficed to say, i havent included student loan payments (which can be downright evil), medical expenses if you are sick (yes, its canada, but there is still the odd bit that comes out of your pocket) and things like, oh, KIDS!
so smart-ass, undercut the industry and charge any price you like, but please, please, please, when i ask for my McChicken sandwich with no mayo, that means no fricken mayo.
…
for reference, the canadian dollar is worth (today) $0.81 US and $0.60 euros
haha nice post. but Im afraid we’re all wasting our breath. I suspect hes just trolling. I aint worried about him or anyone undercutting me and my studio. We’re not cheap and still theres more work then we could possible handle.
Fastdraw,
I rarely chime in on these types of threads but this is just plain ignorance as far as i can tell. First of all, i don;t really worry about you undercutting me or anyone for that matter…because in order for it to have any effect you would have to be far better then everyone else and have an almost omnipresent connection with every client that ever wanted/needed some “ART”. Secondly, by undercutting everyone else…if it actually does work, which it won’t…you will be essentially undercutting yourself. When you increase the supply side of things…demand will go down. Let me clarify, if everyone charged as much as you say they should, the uniqueness and value of what you produce will drop…bringing everything back to quality…which is what clents pay for.
Our industry is inherintly expensive…theres no getting around that. Undercutting is just irresponsible…personally and in the business sense but as a student i can appreciate that its not really a concern for you. Go out and take all the proper paths to doing 3d legitimately, buying all the software and hardware as well as everything else and then let us know how the undercutting is going.
And just for the record…i havea corvette and a brand new pickup truck and i live in a four bedroom house with a pool…all because i get paid what i’m worth and because my bosses clients get the product they want at a price that is fair to them.