Theoretical workstation build

V-Ray V-Ray Common Hardware
1

I’m looking into costs for building a high performance vray render and vray RT workstation. The board that caught my eye is the EVGA Classified SR-2 motherboard which can take 2 Intel Westmere Six Core processors at 3.33GHz.

With these two Xeon processors, there will be 12 physical cores. Hyperthreading (or whatever it is called these days) will double this up to 24 cores. Are all these cores the same ‘power’? In other words, is it really like having 24 ‘full’ cores, or something much less than that?

2

Doesn’t answer your question, but I’ve had my eye on that motherboard as well, one thing to bear in mind is that there aren’t many cases that can accommodate it. In his 3dats tech blog, Andy suggests a supermicro board instead (http://www.3datstech.com/2010/08/september-2010-workstations.html) which presumably isnt as good at overclocking, but fits in normal cases.

3

to answer your HT question, no its isn’t double the cores speed. You’ll get about 30% to 60% extra speed out of Hyperhreading

4

Those gains depend a lot on your system disk and/or RAM also. With 12 physical cores and 24 hyperthreaded, I am curious how much RAM it would take to feed them efficiently when rendering.

5

I am definitely a fan of that EVGA motherboard. I like that I can run non ECC RAM which can be a pretty large savings, plus you get the added benefit of running higher speed memory too. The board is HUGE! So it may not work in many cases, but at the same time there is more room for stuff to breath! All of the these new GPUs get HOT! It sucks that the Northbridge is located directly beneath the video cards, because it definitely is going to run HOT! If you have a big case I think that the EVGA is a great buy.

I am personally thinking about building my next machine around it, but only putting in one CPU and 12GB of RAM. Then upgrading a little later once the processors have dropped and then adding another 12GB of RAM. That would be a pretty nice machine. Not to mention you have the flexibility to run multiple GPUs at 16x which may come in handy in a year or two. I can typically get at least 3 years out of a computer and I think that I may even be able to stretch this one out to 4 years if I play my cards right during the upgrade process.

NOTE: Not a fan of that supermicro motherboard, with only 1 16x PCI Express slot, it makes it a little difficult for GPU Expansion. I already have a HUGE case, nothing a little fiddling with and all should be good. Did I mention the EVGA motherboard is HUGE!!! :wink:

6

I was just looking at it with wishful thinking… Then I started to try to price out cases. The only one that fits it is a Lian Li, and I couldn’t even locate one here in the states, let alone the price. I have an E-ATX case already, and I still don’t think it will fit it.

7

Well, assuming you can get a case for under $500, I managed to assemble an entire system for around $6,000. This would include:

1) Two nVidia 480s: Are you a human?
2) 1200W EVGA PSU: Are you a human?
3) 120 GB SSD drive for the OS: Are you a human?
4) Two Intel 5650s (6 cores each): Are you a human?
5) SR-2 Motherboard: Are you a human?
6) Two WD 600GB Velociraptor drives: Are you a human?
7) 24GB DDR3 1600 memory: Are you a human?

I didn’t include the case or the DVD Drive, and on the fence about a separate RAID card. There’s a slight package deal on some of these items at present. Of course, you could also bump the memory and processors up as well as down - but if you’re spending that kind of money in the first place and are looking for a sweet spot without paying the absolute premium (which could easily run an extra $3,000)… You could also always upgrade the memory and add in even two more graphics cards later. This system should last for 3 or so years before the average consumer systems start to catch up (assuming tablets don’t start dominating the market driving traditional PCs up in price.)

8

im waiting on this to build my next pc. i Think it comes in 1st quarter of 11’.

Intel Core i7 X 995 @ 3.60GHz

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/high\_end\_cpus.html

Scores are great. =)

9

thanks for doing the hard work jujubee, I think I might stick to getting a 980X based system with 2 kick ass graphics cards.

10

The problem with using just graphics cards is you still need good CPUs and RAM to render the final output. It would be a pain to have a super fast RT machine, only to find it takes 8 weeks to render when you send it to render properly!

(Though I am sure RT will develop so that it does render out final images/passes etc)

11

yep, I’m under no illusions about the whole RT thing, I see it really as just a way of quickly setting up lighting on basic stripped down scenes. Most of my work uses all available ram I have (often over 10gb) so I don’t see RT as being much use to me in getting final output (as you say though, maybe things will change)

12

So how is it that the i7 970 @ 3.2GHZ is faster and cheaper than the i7 980 @ 3.33Ghz? That doesn’t make sense to me. Can some1 please explain it?

Also, the i7 975 @ 3.33GHZ is A LOT slower and more expensive than the 970!

13

Looking at pskdude’s chart, a single W3680 beats a single 5650, however you can only use one in a motherboard.

As for the i7 X 995, it says that they only have one sample. I have found nowhere else on the web where it has been documented, except for 2 articles which reference the same benchmark. I have seen no information whatsoever that a version has even been released to the public: “CPU First Benchmarked: 0000-00-00” Plus, it may require an additional motherboard. You’re probably going to be looking at several grand when it first gets released, then you also have to upgrade your motherboard.

I have no idea. I just spent an hour trying to look it up.

I am going to send them an email asking if these are reporting errors and if the second issue DVP3D is a result of overclocking.

14

Jujubee is right on the money with that system. I am planning on building that system with just a single CPU and 12GB RAM at first and then upgrade it later. Not to mention that you can easily overclock the 5600 series processors almost all the way up to 4GHz on air cooling! I think that this machine will provide the MOST flexibility I have ever seen in a custom built computer. You have both bases covered, since it would be about the same as building a 980X single cpu, only you are using Xeons and can add additional CPU, RAM and GPUs later.

It just seems like the best of both worlds. I would am looking at using this case, probably without all the clear panels and stuff, very versatile. http://www.mountainmods.com/pinnacle-24-cyo-p-498.html

15

You could save around $2,000 on that system by cutting out the extra processor, graphics card, and cutting the memory in half. It’s still going to run you a nice $4,000.

To be honest, I’m a bit disappointed in my dual x5355 system. i7s came out shortly afterwards (a little over 6 months) and they were near the same performance at a 1/3 of the cost. Then, a newer standard of PCI Express came out and my motherboard doesn’t support the newer standard causing newer graphics cards to bottleneck a little (some people say around 6%.) I can forget about SLI too as nVidia was being dicks to Intel at the time. It also consumes a ton of electricity and the i7s are less than half of that.

In all, I’ve had the system for 2-3 years and had gotten my money out of it, but if I had just waited (or had a crystal ball), I might not do that again.

If my past experience is any indicator of the future, it may be smart to play it safe and just go with a sub-$2,000 system such as a i7 970 or 980. There’s a significant price to pay for having the biggest computer in the neighborhood.

16

But at that point, what are you gaining by going with a cheap machine? Even if you go with a 980X, 24GB RAM, GTX460 2GB you are still looking close to $3500! What is another $500 to get the ability to almost double the performance after a year, not to mention hardware should have come down in price quite a bit by then.

My question to you is what are you looking for in a computer? You seem to be all over the map.

You must have bought your current system late. We have dual Xeon5355 for almost 2yrs before the iCore7 stuff came out. I am almost 4yrs into my system and it still works great. I even built an iCore7 machine based around the 920. It is decent, but is still 35% slower in some cases than my Dual Xeons.

17

My question to you is what are you looking for in a computer? You seem to be all over the map. If that is your perception than I’m sorry. I’ve simply pointed out the components to one of the highest performing computers you could possibly purchase at the moment. I never said I was looking to buy one - I was just dissecting it for fun.

My second point is/was, that one should probably consider that there is a chance that it may be somewhat outdated six months later with newer technology.

I don’t see what’s so difficult to understand about my statements. I thought I was being very clear.

As for the x5355 - I bought that system pretty much right away (I think there were only 3 boards at the time that supported it.) Maybe my timing is very far off - it seems like yesterday. But I don’t think I got a good two years before the first i7s were released - at least not that I could recall. If I’m wrong about my timeframe, then you have a valid point.

Edit (from Wikipedia):
i7 Release: Nov 2008
Xeon Clovertown Nov 2006

You were right. My memory of time is WAY off. it’s about 2 years of use assuming you bought it right at release. I think I didn’t buy mine until maybe April or May - about 7 months until the prices came down from an astronomical level. So I got maybe about 1.5 years of good use out of it before the first semi-comparable consumer-level chips hit the market. Even then, there still not Xeons. In some things they would outperform (games and other non-multi-threaded applications.) In others such as Max, they didn’t quite match up.

But at that point, what are you gaining by going with a cheap machine? Even if you go with a 980X, 24GB RAM, GTX460 2GB you are still looking close to $3500! Actually, I priced a system out at around $2,500. $1,000 for the chip, $200 for the mobo, case is reused, $500, for the memory, $300-$500 for a graphics card. I could reuse my drives. You bumped the 12GB of RAM you said you were going to get above to 24GB in this example.

So the question is to turn it back around is, “what can you save for $1,500?” Get 2 more graphics cards and/or more memory? The same price for an i7 will well outperform a more expensive/stripped down EVGA SR-2. Of course, that’s assuming you don’t upgrade the SR-2 any time soon.

To summarize, if you think you can make your time and money back by going the more expensive route within an estimated 2 years, then I’d say go for it.

18

Ah, no worries. Unfortunately with technology, if we always waiting six months to buy something, we wouldn’t buy anything because there is always something better coming along. :wink:

My point about being clear was more along the lines of what you were trying to accomplish with the new computer. I misunderstood the fact that you were doing it for fun. My bad. :wink:

I am actually going to be putting in almost 3 different types of workstations when we upgrade. Each of them specialized to the type of work most likely to be done on them. I still feel that a renderfarm is a much better investment and will be more versatile than high-end workstations (Which can’t be used for rendering during the day because someone is trying to get work done.) So my situation may be very different than everyone else here. Most of my stuff doesn’t really work within the VRayRT constraints and so I look at things a little differently. Since I am hopefully going to get another 3+ years out of these machines, I am looking for a LOT more flexibility, especially for potential GPU upgrades that only certain motherboards allow. Not to mention that with that EVGA motherboard, I also get 6GB/s Sata III and USB 3.0.

Unfortunately though, at the end of the day, I have to make a huge presentation to the owners and pitch the hardware costs and all the pros/cons of each different type of workstation. At the end of the day, everything costs money and with my new workflow revolving around Nuke, I am able to easily stretch these current workstations another year if needed. In a way, the slower hardware has forced me to become more efficient with my lighting/material/render settings so I am getting a much better image out with a LOT less rendertime and I have a ton of flexibility now too which I have never had.

I love new hardware! I love the potential GPU rendering has to offer! I just don’t know if any of it will be able to help us within the next couple of years or not. So it makes it a little bit more difficult to plan for major hardware upgrades. :frowning:

19

Thats something I’m thinking of buying. But I will w8 until December to get final RT GPU + Ati support to decide my final farm…

However I will go with

2x 256 SSD raid 0 HDD for Windows
and 2x 64 or 1x 128 SSD For photoshop files cacher drive. Tired of w8 1h for file to save…
Also 48 gb of ram, I wish I could go higher argh !

And great deal from scan to hit 4 ghz+ cpu oc

Bah cant w8 for final ATI support, their shapphire 4gb 2x gpu should smoke anything thats on the market now :o

But anyway until December theres lots of time, hope something new will come up :slight_smile:

20

Who mentioned RT GPU will support ATI? I thought GPU was based on CUDA which is a nVidia technology only… But eh, I don’t know - that’s why I’m asking. :slight_smile:

Unfortunately with technology, if we always waiting six months to buy something, we wouldn’t buy anything because there is always something better coming along. lol. Well, you can just wait six months so that they “latest and greatest” drops exponentially down in price. But who is to really say - it could stay up there for a whole year.

Also, I just received an email back from the Passmark Benchmark regarding some of the discrepancies we saw:

Hello,

1. The “Intel Core i7 x 995” CPU was recently submitted, we have a script that should update the date of when the first benchmark was submitted. However, it seems that the script has stopped working, we are investigating it now. I have manually entered the test date for this CPU according to the submission date we have received.

2. Looking at the raw data for the 2 CPUs you mentioned, there seems to be more samples for 980X in a CPU Marks (5000s-14000s) that are from NON-OVERCLOCK CPUs, please note that the lower values are from some “UNDERCLOCKED” CPUs, currently we do not filter out these results. Just for reference, the 970 has a smaller sample size with the CPU Mark ranging of 9000s-12000s from non-overclock cpus.

Regards,

Richard Ng
PassMark Software