Cost

[flino2004]

how many views would you do for 10K?
besides modeling the house, site, landscaping.

[glorybound]

Heck, even the small jobs take a tone of work, so it's all relative. A lot of the times the CAD files I get don't even work, so how do we get paid for figuring out their CAD files? I just did an apartment building and the building couldn't be built with the drawings I was given, yet I have to spend the time to make it work. These big houses have a lot of large flat surfaces, with stone and roofs that can't show tiling. Large areas of grass and trees... a ton of work. If everything went smoothly, maybe the number was too high, but in my experience, things rarely go as planned. Seeing something already built doesn't explain the work it took to get there. To say that this house is just some boxes with some sweeps is misleading. Taking a set of 2D drawings and building a 3D model is not easy.

I don't think that it's a good idea to compare "they will sell it for 13 million , so i should charge 100k for single image". Your job is your job , you base your price on amount of job and its complexity , not based on final product value. if your price is not accepted - well either client thinks that your quality costs lower , or he does not need that high quality.
And i join ralphr - 10k is too much. And actually it is really simple modelling here. A lot of "sweep profile" , and simple poly modelling + couple of hours for texturing. This project could take not more than 5 days in my opinion. 1 day modelling building , 2 day texturing / details / materials , 3 day - environment , and 2 more days for rendering / approval of lighting and that kind of stuff (of course if client is not super peaky on lighting / composition , than it can take more time). But that's me I like your work , Bobby , though i still think that 10k is overpriced.

[glorybound]

I told him 5-6 views, assuming at least 1 would be an aerial view.

how many views would you do for 10K?
besides modeling the house, site, landscaping.

[Oleg_Budeanu]

Heck, even the small jobs take a tone of work, so it's all relative. A lot of the times the CAD files I get don't even work, so how do we get paid for figuring out their CAD files? I just did an apartment building and the building couldn't be built with the drawings I was given, yet I have to spend the time to make it work. These big houses have a lot of large flat surfaces, with stone and roofs that can't show tiling. Large areas of grass and trees... a ton of work. If everything went smoothly, maybe the number was too high, but in my experience, things rarely go as planned. Seeing something already built doesn't explain the work it took to get there. To say that this house is just some boxes with some sweeps is misleading. Taking a set of 2D drawings and building a 3D model is not easy.

Well i am not just talking working in this domain for 1 year. My experience covers about 10 years , and i've done a lot of exteriors , interiors , animations and etc. As far from what i see - the building is simple to model. It is simple polygonal modelling , extrusion and cornices profiles. Again - that is based on information i can get from the images i see and based on my experience. Grass and trees is a 30 minute deal if you have ready libraries , using forestpack or multiscatter - the other case is when client asks for exact specific tree / bush / grass to be modelled according photos - that is another question and of course price will be higher. Usually if client says : i have CAD / Revit / Sketchup files - i first inspect those files (that takes about 30 minutes as i know what exactly i am looking for - double faces , not closed gaps , poor geometry , coplanar vertices and that kind of typical CAD errors) - if quality of those is adequate i give client one price. If i need to remodel those / partly remodel - client receives another price. In my opinion that is fair.
And yeah, i know that turning 2d CAD files into 3d is not an easy job , but sometimes with right tools and knowledge - it can be even fun thing to do.

[glorybound]

Sometimes people undervalue themselves because the work has become easy, however, it has become easy because you got good at what you do. Most of us wouldn't do an average size house for less the $1000. This house is 10X the size and scope of an average house. I would have done it for less if they were to have asked, however, they obviously don't appreciate my work enough to try to get me. If they had a budget, they should have let me know and maybe we could have met somewhere in the middle. When they first reached out I mentioned some larger projects that I am working on and how the owner and I worked out a price that worked for both of us.

[glorybound]

A job I did last month and the owner called me on Christmas morning. The same client, that I am doing another project for, called me last Friday from a plane on his way home from the middle east. My point is, these larger jobs have very demanding owners. They'll pay you well, but you have to be there when they need you; they are used to that treatment.

Also, on a side note, I can spend hours pushing trees around, adjusting light, and tweaking colors to get things right. Although some might say you are just "dropping some trees in", it is much more than that, at least for me. Like anything, it depends on how much work you are willing to put into something.

Here is a little story. I live about 45 minutes north of a larger town we shop at. There's two main roads to this town and on both roads there is a wood carver. Both wood carvers have tents that they spend all day carving things in. The one wood carver makes pretty simplistic shapes that resemble animals. The other is a master craftsmen that creates some incredibly realistic wood bears, birds, and other animals. Both are wood carver, but that's where the similarities end. The one wood carver prices his bears for a couple hundred dollars and the other wood carver charges a couple thousand. I don't know, it might be a dumb analogy, but it works for me

[Oleg_Budeanu]

they obviously don't appreciate my work enough to try to get me.

You have a good point here. There can be a lot of guessing around why they refused and there can be a lot of reasons. My words about the price were formed only from my perspective , and it is your full right to charge higher amount of money.
And of course price highly depends on where you live and your cost of living - that is something to be added to the price , plus a lot of different stuff and conditions. So actually i understand where this price was formed from.
Thing is that you counted 3-4 weeks to spend on this - that's what surprised me.

Sometimes people undervalue themselves because the work has become easy, however, it has become easy because you got good at what you do.

Well that is not my case definitely The faster you do simple things - the more time you have to polish everything - the better quality you get in the final - the higher price you can request.

[glorybound]

3-4 weeks might be a little pessimistic.

[particlerealities]

I agree Bobby. I'm a leather worker (my side business). I feel the pieces I make are very high quality. Sure, there are others that can do much better, and they usually charge accordingly. If there is someone that can produce the same quality of work as me and they wish to charge less, so be it. Not very wise, in my opinion, but it's a free country! Just because they charge half the price, that doesn't mean I have to. Likewise, the fact that someone is able to charge many times more than me, that doesn't necessarily mean I deserve the same rate, but there is nothing stopping me from trying!

These days, almost anyone can generate a 3D rendering. The question is, does the client want to pay for "almost anyone"...?

[glorybound]

If someone has the money, they generally pay more. People think that if it costs more it must be better, when the fact is, not always. I purchased a pair of BOSE headphones last year. I paid $299 for these headphone, because I wanted the best. My kids could use them, but only at my computer, I paid a lot for them after all. The other day my wife came home with a pair of headphones that were awesome. They were comfortable, had a cord like an old land line phone, and sounded just as good as my $299 pair. I asked her how much... $15.

I know I am not the best, not even close, but people seem to like my work. We all see each others work and we pick things apart, however, most people don't see the things we do. My current project is a few exteriors and some interiors. The developer already has an exterior front, which the architect provided, but I talked the developer into letting me do a better one, or at least they all will be consistent. He said that he doesn't see anything wrong with the architect provided one, but agreed to let me redo it. (if you saw it you would understand)

If people like your work, and if they think that what you can provide will better serve their needs, they'll pay for it. I would challenge people to stop underselling their worth; they'll be much better off. Almost everyone can produce a rendering, but almost all can't do it very good. I know some highly paid photographers, too, yet we all can take a photo.

[glorybound]

Value For Money (PDF) by Ran Segall, Lior Frenkel - This was a good little read about pricing yourself. It's kind of funny. Someone overseas approached me, on Google Hangouts, about how can he can get work. He told me that he is happy, and even feels lucky, to get $50 for one of his renderings. Mind you, I know little about this person; he could live in his parents basement, as far as I know. We talked for a few months, on and off, and I eventually talked him into getting the PDF to help him with his thought process. He got the PDF, read it, and it opened up a whole new world for him. It's not an infomercial, he got a decent paying gig with an engineering firm near where he lives. After looking for work for over a year, without any success, he raised his price exponentially and he is now getting steady work.

[glorybound]

Okay, so things are working out. We exchanged a few more emails and we have a call scheduled tomorrow. Here is a very similar house they would like me to do. Really, who lives in houses like this? Insane!

[flino2004]

a lot little details on the other hand a lot repeated elements all over the house.
not my personal taste and scale and I can't imagine how uncomfortable and lonely would be living in there.

[glorybound]

Oh, but just think about it. The kids on one side of the house and me on the other

[flino2004]

I watched a video from a TV show about billionaires and one guy from Middle East built a huge house... the host of the show got lost inside de walking closet, somebody from the security went inside to "help" him.... 5 people living there with more than 200 people working inside the house.