Vray 5 "use for glossy rays" option removed?!

[clay_creative]

Vray 3 by default had "use for glossy rays" turned off. Then in Vray Next it was turned on by default. Now in Vray 5 we don't have the option to turn it off, it's just on I assume? All of our animations are flickering like crazy with this option turned on. Can this option be exposed as soon as possible please so we can turn it off. Or can Chaos group explain why the option has been removed, is there new option to solve glossy reflection flicker?

[Joelaff]

In theory the idea is to use the Animation preset for the Light Cache. This increases the samples, but more importantly increases the Retrace threshold. I would start by increasing the Retrace threshold, which usually fixes the flickering you speak of.

Alternately you can turn off the Use For glossy rays like this:

vr=renderers.current
vr.lightcache_useForGlossyRays = false

Paste that into the Listener Window.

Why was it removed? Because some people at Chaos keep trying to simplify things, which I view as totally UNWANTED and unneeded. We had the different levels with the Basic, Advanced, Expert settings (which I would always switch to Expert). There is NO NEED to hide features from users. PLEASE STOP DOING THIS!!! The interface is not "cluttered" by these settings. It is made more useful by them.

Features are to be added, not removed. Seriously, Chaos, Stop Removing or Hiding Features! If the users can't figure out the software they can RTFM. Please don't dumb down the software, educate the users instead! You already have the help links in each section of the render settings dialog (the little question mark button). This is GREAT. Maybe make that red instead of removing features

[Buck]

In theory the idea is to use the Animation preset for the Light Cache. This increases the samples, but more importantly increases the Retrace threshold. I would start by increasing the Retrace threshold, which usually fixes the flickering you speak of.

Alternately you can turn off the Use For glossy rays like this:

vr=renderers.current
vr.lightcache_useForGlossyRays = false

Paste that into the Listener Window.

Why was it removed? Because some people at Chaos keep trying to simplify things, which I view as totally UNWANTED and unneeded. We had the different levels with the Basic, Advanced, Expert settings (which I would always switch to Expert). There is NO NEED to hide features from users. PLEASE STOP DOING THIS!!! The interface is not "cluttered" by these settings. It is made more useful by them.

Features are to be added, not removed. Seriously, Chaos, Stop Removing or Hiding Features! If the users can't figure out the software they can RTFM. Please don't dumb down the software, educate the users instead! You already have the help links in each section of the render settings dialog (the little question mark button). This is GREAT. Maybe make that red instead of removing features

A lot of folks don't want to be educated, they just want things done for them. I don't agree with it, but that's how it is.

[clay_creative]

@Joelaff

That is awesome thank you.Do you know how this will work regarding saving the scene and submiting it to network render? As in will it retain this setting switch or will it reset every time we open it? Many thanks

[clay_creative]

Also, I just tried the script and got this error. Am I doing something wrong?

-- Unknown property: "lightcache_useForGlossyRays" in undefined
-- MAXScript callstack:
-- thread data: threadID:71036
-- ------------------------------------------------------
-- [stack level: 0]
-- In top-level

[^Lele^]

We officially suggest only one course of action: You will want to use the presets provided for the LC if you're doing animation, from the default render settings.
You are strongly discouraged from using maxscript to change invisible UI options (they get saved with the file, invisibly so.).
We removed them because they aren't useful, in light of the proposed workflow and various tech enhancements, markedly *not* to simplify things to cater for lazy (!?) users.
They still exist *only* for backward compatibility, not to be passed on as active but hidden.

[clay_creative]

Managed to get the use glossy rays turned off. I think, its hard to know if it actually worked and saved with the file/was submitted to the farm. Still have the flicker. Here is an example video if anyone can have a guess at what might be going on?

https://vimeo.com/443085270/f89f0d8efe

The top image is just the regular setting, middle animation 'LC' settings, bottom, Use glossy rays turned off.

I've found that this flicker still happens with brute force turned on for both GI methods so I guess it's not LC related.

[^Lele^]

Have you reset the settings?
In other words, is that shot rendered with the default, untouched, animation preset, with 3000 subdivs, and a retrace value of 8.0?
Because it looks like you aren't and if you aren't, we can't help you unless you share the scene.
If you are, and that is happening, then please do share said scene (here, my email, support, whatever suits you best.).

Once again, as officially as i can put it: leave the hidden settings alone.

[vlado]

As Lele said, if the flicker happens with BF+BF, then it will be best for us to look at the scene; not sure what's happening right away.

Best regards,
Vlado

[Joelaff]

That is weird flicker. Doesn't look like glossy rays. I am eager to hear what this turns out to be.

[clay_creative]

Done, I've sent you a link via PM. I've stripped out textures and materials to rule them out. Here is a render from the scene I've sent to you ^Lele^ :

https://vimeo.com/443085270/f89f0d8efe

To your point on not changing hidden settings, I understand your stance on not altering them, but this goes against the advice that we were given when we had a similar problem. See this email below from Svetlozar Draganov:

Thanks for the scene and etc.

Regarding the scene usage, it will be only used for investigation here at Chaos Group.
I can even delete it from my hard drive when the troubleshooting is completed, just let me know.

Regarding the issue, it is related to Light Cache > Use for glossy rays option:
http://ftp.chaosgroup.com/support/sc...6_17-22-07.jpg

Disable it and the flickering will disappear.

It renders the same way with 3.6 by the way, so it's not something related to V-Ray Next.



Best Regards,
Svetlozar Draganov
Chaos Group Support

I appreciate that the glossy rays problem is not causing this specific flicker (hopefully we can find out what is), but can you be sure that the above advice from Svetlozar is not relevant going forward? We have seen this reflection flicker many times and simply turned this option off and it was solved. With the option now removed, I'm concerned.

Many thanks

Luc

[^Lele^]

The LC changed from Next to 5.
Checking the scene, now.
Edit: i can find no PM.

[clay_creative]

Hi, ^Lele^ . I typed out the PM, but it said you have not allowed people to PM you. Shall I raise a ticket to send the file or could you PM me your email?

Many thanks

[^Lele^]

Hi, ^Lele^ . I typed out the PM, but it said you have not allowed people to PM you. Shall I raise a ticket to send the file or could you PM me your email?

Many thanks

My email is that in my signature, below.

[clay_creative]

lol, Oh yeah. Man that is small type