I’ve even heard that autodesk releases cracks out there themselves, but that’s not really the point. One thing is to learn on a cracked copy, another is to earn money of one, but a whole other thing is to undercut the market by doing it.
I haven’t seen anyone here say it ISN’T wrong. They might be giving what they think are reasons why people do it, and that those people aren’t necessarily bad people, but its wrong no doubt about it. I learned 3dsmax from a cracked copy. I always knew that one day I would get a job using it where the studio DID purchase each and every license. No access to cracked copy? Autodesk would be out a license, plain and simple. I would have gone another route professionally.
I was under the impression that people where trying to justify it. I mean, everyone keeps using arguments like “well, that’s free economy for ya!” “those are the results of globalisation!”, “you have to adapt to the market!”, and i find the comment about lifting boxes instead of doing 3d somewhat insulting.
I’d rather hear someone condemn this practice, someone say that we should stick together, form some sort of a syndicate, educate the clients, participate in “will render for food” action in order to undercut the oversea market… even a simple “it’s wrong” at first ball would be enough, instead of quoting the price of tea in China.
I’d rather have people with pirated software flood the market with comperable prices and have much higher profit margins, instead of undercutting and making it hard for honest people. So please don’t tell me that these people aren’t bad at all
But would you be ok with a company in China charging $5 per hour if they were using legit software? The fact is even if they pay $5000 for a seat of max they can put it on a credit card and continue charging what they want. When I figure my prices I have a lot of bills to pay and a seat of vray and a seat of max were paid for a long time ago but my overhead hasn’t changed. Infact I imagine that there are many companies in other parts of the world that are completly legit using legit software. But they can afford to make $50 per day because their overhead is lower.
If you are upset because you loose a job to a competitor that can charge a small fraction of what you can charge that is understandable. I have gone in for interviews where I felt set up. The client rejects me when they hear my average price and tell me they have a company in India that charged them $100. I get pissed. Its a crappy feeling. But I really don’t imagine that anything would change depending on whether or not the overseas company uses warez software or not. I don’t. Maybe the company would charge $150 for a job instead of $100. I traveled in India when I was in Goa I paid $1 per night for my hotel on the beach. The reality is that the overhead and operating costs are so different that we cannot compete.
Whenever I hear people complaining about overseas markets it really seems clear there is a misunderstanding. There seems to be an assumption that something amoral is going on. I have heard people complain that the overseas markets must use Sweat Shops to get this labor. No. I think you are doing yourself an injustice (as well as other people in the world) if you assume that there are unfair business practices going on. The underlaying reality is that using the same business model you use to run your business other people can charge a lot less. I cannot say that ever company uses legit software I think many places don’t but I don’t think this is the issue.
I think it sucks and sometimes it really really sucks but I don’t think its wrong.
looks like this is gonna be another one of those long and ongoing topics…
PAILHEAD…i originally did not want to start with this but your last post is full of thoughts that go against each other
youre upset that someone overseas is able to produce a render at a price next to nothing…
me personally, i am upset at what price americans can buy petrol for their unnecessary powerfull cars…resources r running low everywhere but people in us can still buy petrol at a fraction price compared to europe…
face this fact…some things in life are just not fair, but u have to live with it and find a way how to overcome them!!! once u start complaining too much about one thing u will complain forever about everything!
“forming a syndicate” :lol: …get real for gods sake
making some sort of forum or closed web community for paying users for exchange of ideas, mats, tuts, models…that is a solution…u can start one…i ll be hapy to share some stuff with u
…using this forum and being able to post is one massive advantage that warez users dont have!!! of course they can post on evermotion but they will hardly get a reply from vlado :))))))
Imagine how insulting *I* found it.
I referred to myself: i have been a fraction of the blink of an eye last winter from applying for real.
“Dash the stupid market of archviz, i need REAL money for REAL bills.”
3D isn’t only archviz, and archviz isn’t all i ever did in 3d, as you may or may not have gathered.
Trust me, if i had enough nervous strenght, i’d have preferred the jobs i took part in kept winning awards, rather than be underpaid, understaffed, and shite to look at (not talking of studiodim, here, but of freelance contracts from around the world).
As things went, i took an offer to become a director in London as an insult, rather than a serious one, and came back home.
Wrong choiche? Last year, all the answers i could come up with were “HELL YEAH!”
Hence the IKEA reference.
But as i said before, i chose to hold on and get better at this, rather than letting go.
My worst enemy in all of it was myself, surely not the market laws, or pirate students.
Guild: An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards.
doctors, lawyers, architects, engineers, etc… all have some kind of professional association. maybe you arch viz artists would benefit from such an organization. the membership dues could be used to finance any number of things that benefit the group as a whole. with enough members (who pay dues) you could hire lawyers to enforce existing laws or lobby lawmakers to help make new ones. call it the international association of architectural visualization artists…the IAAVA
i imagine something like that would be very difficult to form.
Many service sectors have “Flat Rate Guides” and serve to at least tighten up the spread of pricing, if someone charging $10 an hour finds out everyone else is charging $100, he would be wise to raise his prices to $80 and only have to work 12.5% as hard to make the same money if he sells 25% as many jobs as before his income will still double and the other 75% percent of the work is still available.
I see. That’s a bit like an open and honest ‘this is how much we are charging chaps’ type situation, in the hope that everybody will play fair.
I guess the lack of a worldwide flat rate guide in the viz industry has led people to set thier prices at whatever they feel they can make a profit from.
i believe what he thought was unethical was the possibilty of those using pirated software and charging a fraction of the cost compared to those using legit software and charging a ‘fair value’ for the work.
as someone pointed out it is nearly impossible to figure out who is using legit software and who isn’t. as well as who is able to say what is the fair price. a fair price in the us is different from anywhere else in the world.
pirated software is a problem and will exist no matter if there is a guild or association or any other organization that sets rates etc…
Where is your clear evidence that this company is using pirated software? Or are you making an assumption? If you have no evidence then you really shouldn’t make those kind of allegations. If you have, then report them.
I think it’s wrong to make an automatic link between low price and piracy.
bloody hell pailhead…for some people in the east 20 dollars is as much as 100 bucks for u. U have no evidence that this company or freelancer uses pirated software.
if they charge 20 dollars /render in order to get more clinets in it is perfectly fine…u never know …they might be producing 20 of those per day, or it might be a part of a bigger housing scheme the render…so please dont make assumptions if u dont have any evidence in your hands.
even if they do this in russia or elsewhere i would not be offended or bothered to do something about it…i d rather spend time on differet forums learning stuff and making contacts with people …rather that hunting down suspicious companies and freelancers
