Charging for render nodes

[glorybound]

It's also no longer a hobbyist tool. You'll have to get pretty serious if you are going to invest in the software. But, having said that, will the paying customers be subsidising the nonpaying customers (illegal users)? Also, a big price increase might tip the scale for people on the Mental Ray fence.

[Dariusz Makowski (Dadal)]

Yes I know I saw policies and all. It don't change my mind tho. I will get the 500euro one at the end but still. For new users that just join. Let companies and so on pay bigger $$ my heart is and always will be with smaller 1 man artists I doubt that they are providing high profits for chaosgroup. Well maybe at the moment. But in time they will be minor and big companies will take over big investments with vray.

I don't have facts/numbers its just my assumptions.

[lgrohs]

Freelancers and Hobbyists are very important part of the V-Ray Community, and it's one of the primary reasons we've reduced the initial cost of a V-Ray User License to 750 euros.

Best Regards,
Lon

[Dariusz Makowski (Dadal)]

Ooo now that I did not notice! I only looked at upgrades!

Wow nice one chaos!!!!

[Joelaff]

I completely agree. The new pricing is pretty absurd! This is going back to the per node craziness of the 90s. It is a MAJOR step backwards. Let's hope it doesn't catch on again in the industry. We finally got Mental Ray to give up the per node garbage, and now our beloved Chaos Group decides to go there?

NOBODY wants to pay per node for stuff! Get that into your heads, guys. That is WHY we chose VRay, and WHY we chose Phoenix over fume.

The medium sized studios, like our are getting screwed. It is going to cost over $6k to upgrade to VRay3... VRay 2 was about $1k. That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Charge more for the base package and continue to offer unlimited render nodes.

Companies have based their budgets around unlimited rendering. We sank money into more machines because of it. Now, along comes vRay 3 and they expect us to pay $6k?!?! We will have to explore other options VERY seriously after this. While I love VRay, and understand that software takes money to be written, I think these prices are pretty high to just spring on people for an upgrade, especially if you are going to charge this much for every new version.

I would consider:

1. Nobody wants per node pricing, forget it. That was the 90s.
2. Many studios will defect... The competition is unlimited.
3. If you must do this crazy per node pricing then, at the very least, make it WAY cheaper (like $50/node) for the first year.
4. Or consider a ONE TIME charge for nodes, with all upgrades free forever (for nodes). This is what Fusion does.
5. Nobody was expecting this. It is not in the budgets.

It is great to see VRay 3 coming to beta. But how about showing some love for your medium sized studio customers?

[lgrohs]

The medium sized studios, like our are getting screwed. It is going to cost over $6k to upgrade to VRay3... VRay 2 was about $1k. That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

To get a clearer picture:
1. How many user licenses do you have?
2. How many render nodes would you need to outfit your render farm?

Thanks,
Lon

[joconnell]

People seem to be reading the first line of render node pricing and having a freak out when they see $350 dollars per node rather than reading any further.

Joe, the upgrade from 2 to 3 for a ui license with 1 render node is 420 dollars, for a ui license and 11 render nodes it's 980 dollars so a 560 dollar difference for another 10 render nodes, or 56 dollars per license which is pretty close to what you wanted.

[Joelaff]

1 interactive, 30 render nodes...

I saw the $210/node for 30 nodes...

I did not see upgrade. Looking for that now.

[joconnell]

There's a bit of feedback for the chaos guys so, a few people seem to be arriving at the same conclusion so best highlight the upgrade policy a bit more obviously

[vlado]

yep, point taken...

[Joelaff]

I see flexible term licensing at the bottom.... That is a subscription, no? You have to pay every year or the software stops working?

Have all the licenses gone to subscription? Usually prices of software drop significantly when they move to subscription... The comapny gives back to the users with lower prices in exchange for a guaranteed revenue stream...

I don't see a way to buy perpetual license render nodes for 3.0.

I see:
V-Ray 3.0 for 3ds Max User
+ 11 V-Ray Render Nodes 3.0 for $980

Then the next 19 render nodes seem to be $140 a year each, or $2660 per year.

So total is $3640 (per year?).... This gives us what we have now with VRay 2 that cost about $1k. 360% price increase!

I could get 20 nodes for $2200 a year (boy that makes a lot of sense) for a total of $3180 or a 318% price increase.

Then the freelancers with one license get theirs cheaper... So the medium sized studios get screwed... These are the medium sized shops using and talking about your software in articles, and generally increasing sales.

I really think per node pricing is a step back a decade. Just because a studio has a bunch of render nodes doesn't mean it is made of money. We have set budgets for software. Cloud render farms are worthless for real work, as you spend hours waiting for test renders.

[Joelaff]

I really hope you guys don't go to this per node junk for Phoenix... That is whole reason we went with Phoenix over fume...

[glorybound]

Yes. I calculated a 300% price increase, which will be hard to justify to accounting. I read above that the time of unlimited render notes was over, but that was never the case. My understanding was, if I were to purchase another seat, I would get 10 more nodes. So, 1 license + 10 nodes, is how it worked. If I wanted to add an 11th node, I would have to purchase another 1 license, which would get me 10 more nodes.

[ajroane]

Yes. I calculated a 300% price increase, which will be hard to justify to accounting. I read above that the time of unlimited render notes was over, but that was never the case. My understanding was, if I were to purchase another seat, I would get 10 more nodes. So, 1 license + 10 nodes, is how it worked. If I wanted to add an 11th node, I would have to purchase another 1 license, which would get me 10 more nodes.

I'm not sure I follow your numbers.
Upgrade price from 1.5 to 2.0 = $550
Maximum Upgrade price from 2.0 to 3.0 (with 11 render nodes) = $980
(980/550) * 100 = 178.18%

I'm no math wiz, am I missing something? If you need more than 11 render nodes per user, then I would suggest you contact Vray sales personally. They have mentioned several times that they will be willing to work with you if you have large demands.

Regards,
Andrew

[AlexP]

To get a clearer picture:
1. How many user licenses do you have?
2. How many render nodes would you need to outfit your render farm?

Thanks,
Lon

In our case, once everything is carried out as planned over the next couple of months and all is up and running:-

Currently 2 Vray 2.0 licenses, we would need to get an additional NEW vray license in the next month or so...
Plus 45 nodes

We've literally just in the last couple of months invested in a pile of blades for a not insignificant amount of money.
If I'd known about this costing I would most certainly have gone with less machines that had more power.